Title for Camilla

[Iluvbertie]

No it wasn't neccesary, IMO. That would be saying only first wives, regardless of their behavior or marital status, have the only right to be called Mrs ??? or Lady ????

Just because someone dies with a particular title, does not mean that dead person holds the exclusive right to it.


As you might have guessed (put that crystal ball away), I believe that Camilla should be using the Princess of Wales title, which she has anyway. Of course she should be crowned Queen when Charles becomes King.

Make that two of us. I certainly think she should be using the title Princess of Wales. She most certainly should be crowned Queen when the time comes.

 

[CasiraghiTrio]

I do not recall the Queen ever issuing any grant to call Diana "Princess Diana"; however, in a similar vein, in the months after Diana's death, the Palace did issue a statement saying that it was ok to call her Diana, the Princess of Wales, hence giving the "ok" the reinstate the royal and special "the" which had been taken out due to the divorce.

Enough time has passed I think, and after the passage of much more time, Diana will always be remembered fondly for her contributions both as HRH The Princess of Wales and as Diana, Princess of Wales, but the traditional use of the title will be uninhibited for future use, without all the public "debate" about it. Camilla has the title and doesn't want to use it, that's fine, but I hope that the next woman who has the title will be free to use it without feeling guilty. Oh that Diana..... still causing so much "trouble", hehe. You know, if diana is looking down on all this debate about the title, she is laughing about it. It is rather funny, isn't it? Very silly to "debate" this. Everyone, smile!

 

[branchg]

It is what it is. If Camilla and Charles are satisfied with her style, then we should be too. She is the wife of the heir to the throne and has appropriate precedence and title.

 

[Iluvbertie]

I suspect that Diana may actually be the last person to formally use the title Princess of Wales - not because it was Diana that held the title but because of growing Welsh nationalism.

It is possible that Charles won't create William Prince of Wales because the Welsh don't want a Prince of Wales in the current form. Who knows.

This is all speculation of course and I hope that I am proved wrong but....

 

[branchg]

It could happen. There is also the strong possibility (likely when Charles ascends the throne) of new letters patent being issued limiting the style and title of HRH Prince/Princess of the UK to the children of the Sovereign and the eldest child of the current heir.

 

[Elspeth]

It could happen. There is also the strong possibility (likely when Charles ascends the throne) of new letters patent being issued limiting the style and title of HRH Prince/Princess of the UK to the children of the Sovereign and the eldest child of the current heir.

That's an interesting possibility. It does seem as though recent Princes of Wales have really ignored the Principality, and it's no surprise that the Welsh people might get irked by having a Prince who waxes eloquent about the glories of Balmoral and doesn't show his face in Wales more than once every blue moon or so.

 

[Iluvbertie]

That's an interesting possibility. It does seem as though recent Princes of Wales have really ignored the Principality, and it's no surprise that the Welsh people might get irked by having a Prince who waxes eloquent about the glories of Balmoral and doesn't show his face in Wales more than once every blue moon or so.

I suspect that for William to be created Prince of Wales there would need to be an undertaking that he would live for part of the year in Wales and openly support things Welsh.

Remember the criticism he received some months ago for supporting England in a rugby match against England when he is the Patron, or something, of the Welsh Rugby Union. At least Anne, who has the same position in Scotland openly supports Scotland in these things.

 

[CasiraghiTrio]

I suspect that for William to be created Prince of Wales there would need to be an undertaking that he would live for part of the year in Wales and openly support things Welsh.

Remember the criticism he received some months ago for supporting England in a rugby match against England when he is the Patron, or something, of the Welsh Rugby Union. At least Anne, who has the same position in Scotland openly supports Scotland in these things.

Yeah, very true. Good point! It's understandable, of course, for Prince William to support England, but at the same time, it was thoughtless not to at least make an effort there.... You're right about Anne, and also she sent her kids to Scottish school and her son played Scottish schoolboy rugby. At any rate, lots of countries would be happy, I'm sure, to have Prince William if Wales is a no-go down the line! America's young women would take him as Prince of USA!
I'm being silly; obviously I know that would never happen!

 

[Iain]

I think being styled as Duchess of Cornwall was a necessary concession to the fact that Diana died with the style of Princess of Wales and was the mother of Princes William and Harry. It would have been insensitive for a second wife who was not the mother of the heirs to be styled as Princess of Wales, even though Camilla has the right to do so

Camilla has the title Duchess of Rothesay and that was one of Diana's titles. She should be Princess of Wales and one day be Queen.

 

[msleiman]

Camilla's own desire to be sensitive to her two future stepsons who lost their mother.
But once her husband becomes The Sovereign, that's it.

I had never thought about that before but I bet that is the reason for her title. Camilla seems like that kind of lady that would think about William and Harry feelings. If this is the true reason, then Camilla is truly a Lady!

 

[Elspeth]

Camilla has the title Duchess of Rothesay and that was one of Diana's titles. She should be Princess of Wales and one day be Queen.

She is Princess of Wales.

 

[banda_windsor]

yes she is Princess of Wales. To honor Diana, she chose to be known as the Duchess of Cornwall. But i do hope she'll be the Queen not Princess Consort.

 

[selrahc4]

To honor Diana, she chose to be known as the Duchess of Cornwall.

Do you think that was the reason?

 

[btsnyder]

So if future princes of Wales should devote so much of their time to the principality, should Prince Andrew be hanging out in York? Should Edward and Sophie set up shop in Wessex? Should Philip have a pied-de-terre in Edinburgh? How aften are the Gloucesters and Kents in those corners of the kingdom?

 

[branchg]

yes she is Princess of Wales. To honor Diana, she chose to be known as the Duchess of Cornwall. But i do hope she'll be the Queen not Princess Consort.

I don't think it was done to honour Diana. It was done based on the reality that the public would not accept Camilla being styled as Princess of Wales and the desire to be sensitive to William and Harry's feelings regarding their mother.

Camilla will most certainly be Queen when the time comes. There is nothing in the law or recent precedent for her to be anything else as the wife of The King.

 

[ysbel]

Well the Queen got criticized for releasing a statement during the World Cup that supported England but not Australia and several of our friends down under were not impressed.

So I think the problem goes back further than poor William.

I suspect that for William to be created Prince of Wales there would need to be an undertaking that he would live for part of the year in Wales and openly support things Welsh.

Remember the criticism he received some months ago for supporting England in a rugby match against England when he is the Patron, or something, of the Welsh Rugby Union. At least Anne, who has the same position in Scotland openly supports Scotland in these things.

 

[Roslyn]

I don't think it was done to honour Diana. It was done based on the reality that the public would not accept Camilla being styled as Princess of Wales and the desire to be sensitive to William and Harry's feelings regarding their mother.

Camilla will most certainly be Queen when the time comes. There is nothing in the law or recent precedent for her to be anything else as the wife of The King.

I agree with you about the reasons it was done.

Though she is known as The Duchess of Cornwall, Camilla is still also The Princess of Wales; that is a fact about which there can be no argument. Camilla does not have inferior titles to those which Diana had when she was Charles' wife, it's just that she is known as The Duchess of Cornwall, not by her main title.

I think this has actually had some positive consequences. Her husband gets his income from the Duchy of Cornwall, and by using the title she gives something back to Cornwall by giving it and its people good publicity around the world. Further, in the short term, from the point of view of current events rather than history, Camilla has made the title her own; it has given her an identity of her own which people associate with her and no-one else, and the opportunity to show her personality and prove herself. And I think The Duchess of Cornwall is doing very well.

Once Charles is King his wife will be his Queen Consort. There is no other title for a King's wife to use, and I doubt Charles would initiate or sign off on legislation depriving his beloved wife of her rightful title.

History will record the facts without the emotion, and put things in perspective in the wider scheme of things. Charles' marriage to Diana and the birth of the future King William and his brother will be recorded, as will Charles' divorce and Diana's death and his remarriage. But by then Charles' main claim to fame will be that he was a King of England, etc., and Camilla will have been his one and only Queen.

 

[sirhon11234]

Oh, what a thoughtful post Roslyn. But I do agree that Camilla will be Queen Consort one day, I'am just wondering how long Clarence House is going to keep telling the press & public that Camilla is going to be HRH The Princess Consort.

 

[HRH Kerry]

Question: Who has to initiate the legislature? I just can't see the BRF doing so.

 

[Madame Royale]

Well the Queen got criticized for releasing a statement during the World Cup that supported England but not Australia and several of our friends down under were not impressed.

And rightly so

 

[Sister Morphine]

Just a quick question, and I apologize if this is stupid, but why were some Australians upset that the Queen issued a statement supporting England? I know that she's the head of the Commonwealth and that Australia is part of the Commonwealth, but she was born and raised in England....one would think she'd support them, right?

 

[ysbel]

Because she's also Queen of Australia and Queen of Canada.

 

[wbenson]

Question: Who has to initiate the legislature? I just can't see the BRF doing so.

It would more than likely be the monarch privately with his Prime Minister, who would introduce it in the House of Commons.

 

[CasiraghiTrio]

Just a quick question, and I apologize if this is stupid, but why were some Australians upset that the Queen issued a statement supporting England? I know that she's the head of the Commonwealth and that Australia is part of the Commonwealth, but she was born and raised in England....one would think she'd support them, right?

I agree 100% it is natural for her to support England, but I think the Commonwealth has a lot of expectations from her since she has made it a high priority throughout her reign to represent them, to not forget them. She has usually taken her Commonwealth "duty" very seriously. It was a tough position for her to be in, however. I don't envy her at all. I can't imagine being in such a no-win situation. If she had supported Australia, would England have been upset? Maybe the better thing for her to do was not to say anything about it?? I don't know. That is tough.

 

[branchg]

It would more than likely be the monarch privately with his Prime Minister, who would introduce it in the House of Commons.

No....the Sovereign reigns, but does not rule. The Prime Minister would consult with the Cabinet and take soundings in the Commons. If a majority were in favor of legislation, then The King would be so advised.

 

[HRH Kerry]

So in other words the legislature has not been brought before the Prime Minister for action, right? So this is something that might not ever happen? The Prime Minister would have to decide if he wants to push the issue or not.

 

[wbenson]

No....the Sovereign reigns, but does not rule. The Prime Minister would consult with the Cabinet and take soundings in the Commons. If a majority were in favor of legislation, then The King would be so advised.

I didn't say the sovereign would order the Prime Minister to do it, but would more than likely tell the PM that it was the course of action the family would like taken, and could he please go see if it can be done?

 

[Iain]

So if future princes of Wales should devote so much of their time to the principality, should Prince Andrew be hanging out in York? Should Edward and Sophie set up shop in Wessex? Should Philip have a pied-de-terre in Edinburgh? How aften are the Gloucesters and Kents in those corners of the kingdom?

It's not as simple as that. Wales is a country, the other places are not and because
Wales is a country the prince of Wales should spend more time there.

 

[branchg]

So in other words the legislature has not been brought before the Prime Minister for action, right? So this is something that might not ever happen? The Prime Minister would have to decide if he wants to push the issue or not.

That's correct. The issue was what Camilla would be styled as upon marriage to Prince Charles. Tony Blair made it clear she legally shared equal rank and the titles of her husband, but had chosen to be known as The Duchess of Cornwall (obviously with the consent of The Queen as fount of honour).

The issue of her future title and style would be considered when the time comes, but her preference was to be known as The Princess Consort, rather than Queen. Whether a future PM and Parliament will agree to this precedent is another matter altogether.

 

[branchg]

I didn't say the sovereign would order the Prime Minister to do it, but would more than likely tell the PM that it was the course of action the family would like taken, and could he please go see if it can be done?

I highly doubt Charles would ask the Prime Minister to consider removing his wife's legal right to hold precedence and title as Queen. She is automatically Queen the moment he becomes The Sovereign and any variation is purely a political matter for Parliament, not the Crown.