The Spencer Family, Ancestry and Althorp 1: Ending Aug. 2023

[Incas]

Unfortunately, Chris Hasting mistakenly claimed Diana was born at Althrope, instead of Park House. That took the wind out of his argument for "similarities".

 

[Mermaid1962]

Any Diana-watcher could have told him that!

Unfortunately, Chris Hasting mistakenly claimed Diana was born at Althrope, instead of Park House. That took the wind out of his argument for "similarities".

 

[Menarue]

I agree that Stuart blood has never left the royal family. Indeed, the present royal family, as well as Sarah Ferguson, Diana Spencer AND Camilla Parker-Bowles are all descendants of Charles the Second. (The Queen Mother might have been as well, but I'll need to check up on that!) All of the mentioned people are about fifth and sixth cousins.

Just out of curiousity could you tell me how the present royal family is descended from Charles II. Sarah Ferguson, Diana Spencer and Camilla are but I am missing something here, I thought if the Queen was descended from Charles II it would be through her mother.
Can you help out here?

 

[andrew]

.

"I agree that Stuart blood has never left the royal family"

Elizabeth II descends in the paternal line from James I Stuart through his daughter Elizabeth and granddaughter Sophia.

 

[Menarue]

"I agree that Stuart blood has never left the royal family"

Elizabeth II descends in the paternal line from James I Stuart through his daughter Elizabeth and granddaughter Sophia.

I totally agree, they are descended from James I, I was curious how Lord of Cowley could say they were descendants of Charles II. That would be really be something new to me.

 

[Elspeth]

Yes, like Andrew said, she's descended through Charles II's sister Elizabeth, not through Charles himself. At least, not legitimately. Chances are that the Queen Mother's ancestry has some illegitimate Stuart blood but I'm not certain.

 

[Jo of Palatine]

Just out of curiousity could you tell me how the present royal family is descended from Charles II. Sarah Ferguson, Diana Spencer and Camilla are but I am missing something here, I thought if the Queen was descended from Charles II it would be through her mother.
Can you help out here?

Charles II. only had illegitimate children through his mistresses - so while there is a relationship, it comes from the wrong side of the blanket. While Charles descended from CharlesII.'s aunt Elizabeth Stuart, princess of Scotland and England, mother of the Electress Sophie.

 

[Menarue]

Lord of Cowley please come in. You said the royal family is descended from Charles II all I want to know is how you came to that conclusion or if you made a mistake. As far as I know they are not descended from any of Charles II´s mistresses. I know very well how Sophie the Electress of Hanover comes into it, that is not what I am interested in. Any descendants of Charles II´s mistresses have Stuart blood wrong side of the blanket or not. Diana, I believe is descended from more than one of them. Both Louise de Keroualle and Barbara Villiers, but I would have to look that up.

 

[GillW]

Diana descended from several different lines from illegitimate children of Charles II. Henry Fitroy, 1st Duke of Grafton, son of Barbara Villiers Palmer (Countess Castlemaine, Duchess of Cleveland) has two lines of descent to Diana. Charles Lennox son of Louise de Keroualle (also ancestor to Sarah Duchess of York and Camilla Duchess of Cornwall). Lucy Walter's son James Crofts was also an ancestor of Sarah Duchess of York.

 

[Menarue]

Thanks GillW that is what I thought. Now I am trying to remember if there are descendants through Nelly Gwynne, her eldest boy died young but there was a second. There were so many mistresses and Charles II was a very benevolent father. In fact the more I read about him the more I like him, he had his faults but he was a kind person and had a wonderful sense of humour.

 

[GillW]

For a quick summary you should visit the Wikipedia site for Charles II. The you can look up other links & track down the other information. It lists all Charles II acknowledges offspring. But I don't believe Diana descended from Nell Gwynne's children.
Charles II of England - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

(I'll just throw in the comment on Charles II-
John Wilmot, 2nd Earl of Rochester, joined the "Restoration Court". Of Charles, Wilmot wrote:
God bless our good and gracious king,
Whose promise none relies on;
Who never said a foolish thing,
Nor ever did a wise one.
To which Charles is reputed to have replied:
"That is true; for my words are my own, but my actions are those of my ministers.")

 

[colynsmomma]

I am reading a book about Harriet Spencer. I have not finished it so I dont know how the realtion is but she is the sister of Georgiana. I also read a book about the duchess of bedford which has Georgiana in it and these are some very intresting women. It was said that these women were rivals being one tory and one wig.

 

[georgiea]

Diana descended from several different lines from illegitimate children of Charles II. Henry Fitroy, 1st Duke of Grafton, son of Barbara Villiers Palmer (Countess Castlemaine, Duchess of Cleveland) has two lines of descent to Diana.

The book that I read, about King Charles II, mentioned that the Countess Castlemaine was very sexual, beautiful, selfish and headstrong redhead. She used her charms to keep the King's attention from his Queen for a very long time till Charles got tired of her whining.

 

[GillW]

There are individual biographies of the various important mistresses of Charles. For Castlemaine I read a book called "The King's Whore" which was a real revelation, and if you also read ones about "pretty witty Nell" (Gwynne) and Louise de K (never can spell it right!) you get a really good all around picture of how the menage worked.

 

[pinkie40]

I'm looking forward to the movie starring Keira Knightly as Georgiana! I've met the late Duke of Devonshire(he was a guest at a private art exhibit of the Bloomsbury Group here in Dallas at Southern Methodist University in 1984) and the current Duke of Devonshire (he brought the treasures of Chatsworth a small museum neraby) and some local horticulturists developed a "Duchess of Devonshire" rose. Too bad they are a bit scary in their proximity of Hitler (Debo's sisters) and to the Fascist movement. When the current Duke was a guest speaker at a lecture, the audience members were forbidden to ask questions regarding Diana (the inquest was pending) but were encouraged to ask about Prince William as he was then "working" the farms at Chatsworth.

 

[georgiea]

I'm looking forward to the movie starring Keira Knightly as Georgiana! I've met the late Duke of Devonshire.

How exciting pinkie to meet the Duke. I can not wait to see the movie too!

 

[pinkie40]

Yes, it was exciting both times to rub elbows with the aristocracy!

Also, Georgiana's famous portrait was used on several invitations to events of the current Duke. Later, the exhibit went to New York City where it was met with much more sophistication, imo. The reason the exhibit was held at such a small venue was because of an introduction of some local people thru Sophie, Countess of Wessex to the late Duke at the wedding festivities of she and Prince Edward. One of her former flatmates who is now a godmother to James is from my hometown.



I believe at the time the current Duke was here another movie was also filming at Chatsworth.

 

[Sasha3]

I heard on TV the other day that Sarah Palin is related to Diana now which tree did she come from. President Roosevelt is old news but Palin is new. Just Curious.

 

[magnik]

Sasha3 about presidents try here Worldroots.com

I found an article http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/new...-Princess-Diana-and-Franklin-D-Roosevelt.html

Here you go link to John Strong's descendants http://geneweb.inria.fr/roglo?lang=en&m=D&i=2072514&v=12&t=L&bd=0&color=

 

[Mermaid1962]

It might be a "stretch" to put this under Earl's Spencer's Family (his ex-step-grandmother), but this is a fascinating article. Barbara Cartland believed that Raine's father was the late Duke of Kent.

A drunken husband and five secret lovers: The novel Barbara Cartland never wanted you to read | Mail Online

 

[Skydragon]

It might be a "stretch" to put this under Earl's Spencer's Family (his ex-step-grandmother), but this is a fascinating article. Barbara Cartland believed that Raine's father was the late Duke of Kent.

Oh my!

 

[Mermaid1962]

Yes, exactly! That would make Raine the Queen's biological first cousin, and the current Duke her half-brother. The mind boggles. Ms. Cartland certainly had an interesting life. Perhaps her sugary novels were as much a refuge for her as they were for countless other women.

Oh my!

 

[iowabelle]

It might be a "stretch" to put this under Earl's Spencer's Family (his ex-step-grandmother), but this is a fascinating article. Barbara Cartland believed that Raine's father was the late Duke of Kent.

A drunken husband and five secret lovers: The novel Barbara Cartland never wanted you to read | Mail Online

The mind boggles at the scenario of Earl Mountbatten marrying Barbara Cartland.

The whole article is incredible, about all the tangled lives of the British upper crust. Somehow I just can't see Raine Spencer being the half-sister of the great Princess Alexandra of Kent.

 

[iceflower]

Lady Raine Spencer attending the launch ceremony for an in-store
promotion of Malaysian craft at Harrods, London, UK. 26/02/2009

** Pic 1 ** Pic 2 **

 

[Vasaborg]

Princess Diana

Diana descended from several different lines from illegitimate children of Charles II. Henry Fitroy, 1st Duke of Grafton, son of Barbara Villiers Palmer (Countess Castlemaine, Duchess of Cleveland) has two lines of descent to Diana. Charles Lennox son of Louise de Keroualle (also ancestor to Sarah Duchess of York and Camilla Duchess of Cornwall). Lucy Walter's son James Crofts was also an ancestor of Sarah Duchess of York.

She was also descended from Henrietta an illegitimate daughter of King James II, (brother of Charles II )by Arabella Churchill.

 

[georgiea]

Daily Express | Express Yourself :: The illegitimate royals

Interesting article about illegitimate royals

 

[Sengreal]

I agree that Stuart blood has never left the royal family. Indeed, the present royal family, as well as Sarah Ferguson, Diana Spencer AND Camilla Parker-Bowles are all descendants of Charles the Second. (The Queen Mother might have been as well, but I'll need to check up on that!) All of the mentioned people are about fifth and sixth cousins.

Oh wow! Sorry for eavesdropping! I just joined & am from an Pacific Island Nation that was ceeded to Queen Victoria and was always interested in learing more of the Royal Family of Great Britian ever since I can remeber.
In your post you mentioned that Camilla Parker Bowles & Sarah Ferguson together with Diana were all descendants of a royal being - Charles II. Do you mean that are also of royal bloods too??

 

[iowabelle]

Sengreal, they would not be not considered to be of royal blood, since they are descendants of a person who was not married to a royal. Camilla, Sarah and Diana are all descendants of children "born on the wrong side of the blanket", to put it politely.

Most of their ancestors would have been given titles but would have been considered noble/aristocratic, versus royal

 

[gfg02]

Princess Diana family offers Rubens in £20 million sale
Princess Diana family offers Rubens in £20 million sale - Yahoo! News UK

 

[gfg02]

This is the latest issue of World of Interiors (the British ed.).
It includes a wonderful photo report about Althorp House from cellar to attic...
What a beautiful start Diana had in life ...
http://www.worldofinteriors.co.uk/