The Duke and Duchess of Bragança and Family: February 2008- December 2014


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Even though he is not a sailor, D. Duarte was one of the honour guests in the dinner organized by the Nautic Club of Cascais. He represented the royal family, since king D. Luís and his son D. Carlos were deeply linked to this seaside village:

http://img95.imageshack.us/img95/5455/cncascaisl.jpg
(from Lux)
 
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http://www.jornalfontenova.com/main.asp?pag=noticia.asp&artigo=7&menu=1&cod_menu=101

D. Duarte visited Portalegre and criticized the lack of investment in this region.
The trip included a series of visits to the churches of S. Lorenço and S. Francisco, to Santa Casa da Misericórdia of Alegrete and to the social enclosure of Santo António. This visit concluded with a dinner with the supporters of the monarchist cause.

 
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TRH the Duke and Duchess of Bragança attended the 90th birthday party of the Duke's aunt D.Teresa d'Orléans Bragança in Estoril.

There is a photo in this week's Caras.
May be someone can post it ...
 
Thanks for the thread.

This Friday TRH the Dukes of Bragança, with their children and van Uden cousins attended the XII Royal Bullfight, that this year took place in Évora, the town where last year Diana de Cadaval and Charles-Philippe d'Orléans got married.

It was a really good bullfight and had a particular innovation.
Instead of a band as it was usual, the musical part was performed by 3 guitarr palyers and some fado singers.

Bullfights and Fado are two great portuguese traditions, they've been hand in hand for ages, but it was the first time that a fado replaced the more usual zarzuelas.

As in the old Coca-Cola advertisement, that portuguese speaking participants will recognize:
"Primeiro estranha-se :unsure: , depois entranha-se :D"

At first you find it a bit odd, then you adhere.
 
JSP said:
Bullfights and Fado are two great portuguese traditions, they've been hand in hand for ages, but it was the first time that a fado replaced the more usual zarzuelas.
Click to expand...
Perhaps the oddity has to do with the fact that bullfights are more a Spanish tradition (just like zarzuelas), rather than Portuguese... They may be somehow appreciated in the South, bur not really in the whole contry. People from the North generally despise bullfights... But then again, fado is also really not a national tradition; it's traditional in the South (or should I say Lisbon), so perhaps they work together anyway.


On another note, D. Duarte and D.ª Isabel attended the presentation of Jaime Nogueira Pinto's book about D. Nuno Álvares Pereira:

http://img148.imageshack.us/img148/4079/jaimenogueirapinto.jpg
(from Lux magazine)
 
Bullfights are an iberian tradition, meaning Portugal + Spain and not more a Spanish one rather than Portuguese.
And bullfights have not been confined to Portugal and Spain.
In a lesser scale you will find them in France and in many ex spanish colonies in America.
I agree that "we" did not "export" it to Brazil but I am aware that there were bullfights in Angola and Mozambique before 1974.

And it is not completely true that bullfights aficionados are mainly in the south.
Póvoa do Varzim near Porto has one of the greatest bullfight rings in Portugal and certainly the largest in the north.
People in the north may not have so much aficion but that does not mean they despise bullfights :glare:.

The same happens in Spain.
When I was in Barcelona, I was told that in Catalonia bullfights are not at all popular, not that locals despise them, they just don't give them the importance like their fellow countrymen in Madrid, Extremadura or Andaluzia, not forgetting those mad people of Pamplona .

Like a bullfighter after a corrida I give you :flowers:
 
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Thanks fot the video.
And I am glad you liked the flowers :)

On today Revista Caras there is an article of the visit TRH made to Évora.
Unfortunately no photos at the bullfight, but a pic with D.Duarte's cousin AD Joseph von Habsburg (Jr) and his family.
 
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Hello everyone!

I know this is not a thread about bullfights :lol: but I just wanted to say that IMO, these are not a tradition in Portugal. Some people like it, some attended these shows (especially in Alentejo, south of Portugal) , but the majority of the Portuguese people don't see it as a tradition.
I would say that, soccer is a portuguese tradition :D

I dislike when royals attend these corridas...
I know they have the right to be there and enjoy it as much as they want, but I wonder if they attend them because they really like to see a bull being punished or because the corridas are related to the old and good times in Portugal?

The Irish nuns of my catholic school used to say that... the bullfighters should be punished by saint Francisco de Assis. hehe!
 
Regina said:
I wonder if they attend them because they really like to see a bull being punished or because the corridas are related to the old and good times in Portugal?
Click to expand...
Yes, I agree with you, Regina (even if JSP will agree to disagree ;) )...

From my own perception, and aside from the South (where more people seem to enjoy them), bullfights in Portugal are essencially a Marialva thing, which is confined to a dozen monarchists and "pedigree" families, who go to these bullfights twice a year, because "noblesse-oblige" and they were taught from the cradle to love horses and bulls, along with the "holly F trinity": Fado, Fátima and Family :cool:

Marialvas are a minority in Portugal, though...

_________


These are the photos published by Caras, which JSP mentioned above:

http://img136.imageshack.us/img136/7269/caras1.jpg
http://img136.imageshack.us/img136/1944/caras3.jpg
With the Habsburg cousins:
http://img136.imageshack.us/img136/5718/caras2.jpg
 
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What do you exactly mean with "Marialva"?
That's interesting: the 3 F!! (Fatima is related to the sanctuary, right?)
I must again say how much I appreciate the way of living of the dukes of Braganca: there is no other non-reigning royal whith so many "royal" duties and the duke seems to have good and frequent relationships with much of the gotha!
I know I am ridiculous with my royal-to-royal wedding plans even for very young royals, but guess what I thaught seeing that photo of the Bragancas with the Habsburgs..:ROFLMAO:
 
amedea said:
What do you exactly mean with "Marialva"?
Click to expand...
:D Marialva is a Portuguese social stereotype, who takes the name after a literary character of José Cardoso Pires ("A Cartilha do Marialva"). He's characterized as a privileged man, who lives on the shadow of the family's name and estates; Marialva embodies a kind of provincialism and feudal vision of the Universe, governed by principles of authority, divine hierarchies, national heroes and family tradition... all envolved in a perfect "pax ruris"...

I once read a funny article about "Marialvismo", where the author described the "marialva-playboy" as a "pedigree" guy who was born in Ribatejo, Alentejo or somewhere else around Tejo :D , and who has 3 favourite animals:
1. horses,
2. women (whom he considers as a kind of pure-bred mare :D ),
3. bulls.

Curiously enough, he considered the Câmara Pereira guy as the best marialva specimen: a misoginous fadista, who is fond of bullfights and whose ultra-conservative political ideas would be somewhwere between rural municipalism and Catholic monarchy :cool:

It's a stereotyped vision, of course... But i'd just thank God they are a minority :lol:
 
Thanks a lot, you have been very clear, Elsa!
 
Answering Elsa Part 1

:D
Elsa M. said:
:D Marialva is a Portuguese social stereotype...
Click to expand...
Good Gracious :eek::eek::eek: !
What I read.
Marialvism did not start with José Cardoso Pires.
It comes from the XVIII century and takes it name after ... who would say (?) the 5th Marquis de Marialva.

http://www.geneall.net/P/per_page.php?id=32703

He was a keen horseman and bullfighter from the times of King D.José.
At that time, the aristocracy was idle, specially because they were not supposed to run any business, only their lands.
In the vast areas (lezírias) of Ribatejo mainly and also in Alentejo, they raised bulls, together with oxen and cows and thus the bullfight tradition got an impulse.

Kings D.Pedro II and D.Miguel were bullfighters themselves.
There is an anedocte according to which D.Miguel :devil:, while still a prince, let free a “garraio” (young bull) in Queluz Palace and provoked chaos among the RF ladies-in-waiting and other servants :w00t:.
D.Carlos was also an aficionado, althought his complexion prevented him from participating :king3:.

Until the mid 19th century, bullfights and fado did not mixed, at least among the upper class, the one who produced the horsemen-bullfights or cavaleiros.
The Lisbon Fado (not to be confused with the Coimbra Fado – played and sung by the university students :graduate: ) was a popular song played and sung in the “tascas” of Lisbon bas-fond :cheers: .

The best representant of Marialvism, however, was not a Marialva but the 13th Count of Vimioso

http://www.geneall.net/P/per_page.php?id=22392

who took as mistress :shifty: the famous fado singer “A Severa” :whistling:.

When you say that marialvas are priviledged menwho live on the shadow of the family's name and estates you are truly mistaken:

For many years the “Cavaleiros” did come from ancient families such as the Marialvas, the Vimioso or the Count of Arcos (sure you know the text about the last bullfight in Portugal at the time of D.José- there is even a fado on that sad event), and in moder times the Ribeiro Telles.
Naturally they were the ones who could aford maintaining several horses.

But you are forgetting :

a) Most of modern days cavaleiros are not slightly related to the old families : João Moura, Paulo Caetano, Bastinhas, Rui Salvador, etc.;
b) Marialvism is under attack :eek::shock::D since nowadays there are Women Bullfighters, such as Sónia Matias, Ana Baptista, Isabel Ramos, etc. and there was of course the famous Conchita Citrón who “bullfighted” both on horseback and on foot

http://semanal.omirante.pt/noticia.asp?idEdicao=379&id=51394&idSeccao=5669&Action=noticia
http://www.maxima.xl.pt/0306/mc/100.shtml

c) that the “Toureiros a pé”, “Forcados” and “Campinos” who are in general humble and poorer men who work in the fields with horses and bulls and for many of them the Tourada is a kind of an initiation rict and a way to escape a not so underpriviledged destiny.

You are right about the Marialva’s 3 favourite animals, but not that right about the holy trinity of the 3 F’s: It’s Fátima, fado and football, not family.
 
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Answering Elsa and Regina

As to Regina question:
I wonder if they attend them because they really like to see a bull being punished or because the corridas are related to the old and good times in Portugal?

In my humble opinion, neither !
Though you may doubt, people attend because they like a true traditional show.
Nobody goes there to see a bull being punished but to see both the bull and the bullfighter show their bravoury and courage and the bullfighters perform their Art :clap::clap::clap:.
And some times -sadly- the bull is the winner :ninja: .

As Elsa said, unlike Spain, the bull is not humiliated and killed in the arena as in Spain where they cut its ears and tail as a trophy to give to “el matador”.

As a reward of its performance his life is spared and often, after treatment, he is left free in the leziria to the rest of its days.

Bullfights are a transversal tradition that crosses the whole society, men and women, old and new, rich or poor.
Naturally the left-wingish :alien: raise the banner of the political incorrectness of the bullfight and there have been some mild riots when the anti-bullfights associations “plant themselves” at the door of Campo Pequeno – Lisbon arena, provoking the participants and attendants.

And a good "Marialva" never runs from a good fight :boxing::bangin::boxing:and the anti-bullfights have to run away with their tails between their legs :bounce:

They “forget” that if bullfights were to be prohibited, the bull would be another race in extinction as they are raised only to take part in corridas and as breeders.

Although more popular in the south, as I said, Póvoa do Varzim is the northist capital of the aficion

http://bolasetetouradas.blogspot.com/2009/07/1-grande-corrida-de-toiros-revista.html

Revista Flash will hold there its 1st tourada.

A very very very marialvist article :devil::devil::devil: :
Scroll to Monday August 8, 2005
http://ultimodosmarialvas.blogspot.com/2005_08_01_archive.html
 
Of course "Marialvismo" originally takes the name from the Marquis of Marialva, but the social cliché in modern society is mostly defined in José Cardoso Pires' delicious treaty (which, by the way, makes a series a considerations about the tradition of the machist Marialva in the Portuguese society and literature: from D. Francisco Manuel de Melo in the 17th century up to the salazarist dictatorship)... don't underestimate me :D
But you're right in your account about the marquis... I very much enjoyed reading it ;)

Oh, and the "holy trinity" was adapted by me in order to fit the Marialva's likings... you don't certainly imagine a good old Marialva putting on a t-shirt to spend Sunday watching football games on TV :D Unless, of course, it's a game of Sporting... the very noble club of the Vizcount of Alvalade ;)
 
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Of course "Marialvismo" originally takes the name from the Marquis of Marialva, but the social cliché in modern society is mostly defined in José Cardoso Pires' delicious treaty (which, by the way, makes a series a considerations about the tradition of the machist Marialva in the Portuguese society and literature: from D. Francisco Manuel de Melo in the 17th century up to the salazarist dictatorship)... don't underestimate me :D
But you're right in your account about the marquis... I very much enjoyed reading it ;)

Oh, and the "holy trinity" was adapted by me in order to fit the Marialva's likings...

I am schocked :eek: !
That's re-writing history :wacko: .

you don't certainly imagine a good old Marialva putting on a t-shirt to spend Sunday watching football games on TV

Not a good old Marialva, but I know many new Marialvas who act like that :whistling:

:D Unless, of course, it's a game of Sporting... the very noble club of the Marquis of Alvalade ;)

There, you are right.
I am not a football aficionado :lol: but I grant you that Sporting is the most noble club :king3:.

Did you know that D.Carlos, who had an interest for most sports, attend the first Lisbon-Porto game ? Neither did I :).
Nor that in the first years of the game the Club Internacional de Futebol defeated Real Madrid , the first time a portuguese team played abroad :).

To keep it royalish, the spanish did not have little prince C.Ronaldo yet :lol::lol::lol:

http://pt.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sporting_Clube_de_Portugal

Futebol em Portugal - Wikipédia, a enciclopédia livre
 
I am schocked :eek: !
That's re-writing history :wacko: .
Click to expand...
Oh, don't be shocked... rewriting history is what most every post-modernist do ;)

"The first Lisbon-Porto game"? Who won? :D
 
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JSP and Elsa, thanks for your explanations, I (really) enjoy them.

But although I understand that some people enjoy touradas, I still dislike royals attending these shows. Animals were not Created to be hurt by humans without an important reason. No matter what some say, the bulls do get hurt. Men are to use animals, because animals are inferior to humans, but they are to protect them too. So I don't understand how royals who give beautiful speeches about environment and the need to protect nature, are the same who attend touradas...

I know that Bloco de Esquerda wants to forbid corridas but it doesnt mean that just because those anarchists thinks that, all who are against touradas must be lefty people! I have nothing to do with them, i am quite conservative but I still dislike these kind of spectacles.
I think many royals wouldn't like to attend a show like this, and they are not lefty. Queen Sofia dislikes touradas... and she is not an anarchist! :D

Rich and poor may like touradas but it is a show related to the old aristocracy, the same who still defend the mogardio system, who believe Portugal was a better country when it had an absolute monarchy system, and so on. Did you ever attend a noite dos conjurados? If you did, you know most people there are like I described... and that's so sad, IMO.

And I agree with Elsa about marialvas. Nuno da Câmara Pereira once said something like "na minha cozinha quem manda é a galinha". This means "In my kitchen, the boss is the chicken". The chicken is... the woman.

(Please, Elsa, just a request from me: spare my Sporting :D :flowers: )
 
I saw a news yesterday on a portuguese magazine about the oldest child of the Dukes. He was playing with a pressão de ar (I don't know what is the correct translation)... Did anyone read that?
 
Regina said:
JSP and Elsa, thanks for your explanations, I (really)
I think many royals wouldn't like to attend a show like this, and they are not lefty. Queen Sofia dislikes touradas... and she is not an anarchist! :D
Click to expand...

You will probably know that one of the events of the Duke of Bragança's wedding was a Royal Bullfight Gala à Antiga Portuguesa.
And all the guests attended and apparently enjoyed.

I know Q.Sofia dislikes touradas, as much as her mother-in-law, the late Count of Barcelona, adored them.

I read that Elena is the more aficionada of the 3 siblings.
I expect Mummy Sofia would have taught them to dislike :glare:

Don't know about Juan Carlos but given his taste for killing previously drunken bears...:whistling:
Maybe a case of public virtues and private vices :D.

Another grand aficionada is of couse the duchess of Alba :clap: , a woman so aficionada she even got a torero as son-in-law :lol:.

You said you dislike seeing royals attend touradas.
Any comments on them attending hunting parties ?
 
Regina said:
Rich and poor may like touradas but it is a show related to the old aristocracy, the same who still defend the mogardio system, who believe Portugal was a better country when it had an absolute monarchy system, and so on. )
Click to expand...

There come the simplistic explanation.

Touradas are not related solely to the old aristocracy.
It would mean we have tons of aristocrats :lol:.

As I said before, "Toureio a cavalo" may be related to the old aristocracy, those who could aford maintaining several horses.
And it is well documented on the fact that today Cavaleiros still dress on the fashion of the XVIIIth century with their embroided coats and tricorn hats.
Much prettier than in Spain.
For those who can understand portuguese, you will understand the reason on the link below.

But "Toureio apeado" has always been the feud of the people, the campinos and field workers, who neither could aford a horse, nor were they allowed to compete with the aristocrats, the only ones who could tourear horse riding.

So, touradas are a transversal tradition, either on what concerns the people who like and pay to watch, and on what concerns the "actors" although nowadays you don't see any member of any aristocratic house acting in a tourada.

For those who never had the priviledge to see a Corrida de Gala à Antiga Portuguesa, follow the link below.
Don't worry ! It just shows the Cortezias that take place before the corrida on the 18th century fashion.

You won't see neither the bull, nor the Cavaleiros or Toureiros in action.
Enjoy it :flowers::flowers::flowers::

YouTube - Corrida de Gala à Antiga Portuguesa-RTP 50 anos

P.S. (lagarto, lagarto) "the same who still defend the mogardio system, who believe Portugal was a better country when it had an absolute monarchy system, and so on."

I guess I should defend the old morgadios :rolleyes2:.
After all, I am the elder of 3 brothers, and suddenly, the idea of shipping one of my brothers to the army and the other to the clergy seems very appealing :lol::lol::lol:.
As to the idea that the old absolute monarchy worked better than the new democratic republic, you don't want me to answer, do you ?

José
 
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