Sussex Residences

[Pranter]

I am betting they 'Americanized' some of the room sizes when they did the renovations.



LaRae

 

[Rena M.]

Its OK for now. However if Harry and Meghan have more than two children (and Twins aren't unheard of in older women's pregnancies), they might be stretched for room. Apparently there is no accommodation for RPOs at the Cottage either.

There is also a separate building 8,76 m (28,74 ft) x 4,21 m (13,82 ft). I have no idea, is it big enough for RPOs?



It's possible that there are guest rooms at Frogmore House, they can use.


I've a feeling they prefer to live in a smaller house for privacy reasons, because it means less staff.

 

[Lilyflo]

Thanks @Rena for the measurements.

I live in a cottage & our American friends here would probably find some of my rooms 'cosy' to say the least.

When I was raising my family, I lived in a much larger Georgian house, which was beautifully proportioned but even so, the rooms might have seemed small to those more used to open plan living.

I wouldn't be surprised if H&M have knocked some internal walls down to create larger rooms from a warren of small rooms, which I imagine it must have had when it was 5 staff homes. It's possible that some of the original rooms were made smaller to accommodate staff & they've just removed modern walls.

 

[Pranter]

I think 'smaller' is a subjective term too. We live in 2200 sq feet which I consider large but some folks would think anything under 5000 sq feet to be small.



LaRae

 

[O-H Anglophile]

There is also a separate building 8,76 m (28,74 ft) x 4,21 m (13,82 ft). I have no idea, is it big enough for RPOs?



It's possible that there are guest rooms at Frogmore House, they can use.


I've a feeling they prefer to live in a smaller house for privacy reasons, because it means less staff.

The RPOs are only going to need an office and maybe a break room/lunchroom, they are not going to live/sleep onsite.

I agree about the smaller house for less staff. This way they can pretty much have staff that comes in daily or a few times a week, not that live with them.

 

[Hallo girl]

Lets be realistic here, the Sussex family are not living in a castle, mansion or anything remotely like that. By the same token do not let the word ' cottage ' lead you down the wrong road. As a previous poster pointed out, there were 5 cottages put into one, so you are immediately speaking about at least 10 rooms. As somebody commented we do not know how they then reconfigured the property, but I would agree at least 4 bedrooms.
The royals share staff , so staff from the castle would come over and do some daily chores, gardeners etc. once again other than possibly a nanny there would be no need for live in staff. You are right they do not need the huge mansion. I am sure it is beautiful though, would love a peek.

 

[tausi]

From some of the minor description in RBWM government website, it seems they converted into 3+1 bedrooms, which is 4 bedrooms total.

it's not straight forward information - as most things were not published for security purposes.

0000U4NIBU000 | Frogmore Cottage Frogmore Windsor SL4 2JG

 

[Rena M.]

I think 'smaller' is a subjective term too. We live in 2200 sq feet which I consider large but some folks would think anything under 5000 sq feet to be small.

Frogmore Cottage has 2 floors (!), so it is approximately 12 066 sq feet (1121 m2)

 

[MARG]

I think all these quoted plans were approved in May of 2018 and I have no idea when these plans were submitted. What is known is that HM decided to gift the residence to a newly restored single dwelling came many months after that and we have yet to discover the submission or the permission with some or all of its parameters.

However, it should be noted that Frogmore Cottage is a two-storey building with a single storey annex and wing and the plans quoted only deal with the single-storey wing or annex.

By 1934, twenty-one people were residing in Frogmore Cottage.

http://royalmusingsblogspotcom.blogspot.com/2018/11/frogmore-cottage-history.html

 

[Lilyflo]

From some of the minor description in RBWM government website, it seems they converted into 3+1 bedrooms, which is 4 bedrooms total.

it's not straight forward information - as most things were not published for security purposes.

0000U4NIBU000 | Frogmore Cottage Frogmore Windsor SL4 2JG

From all the documentation in the above link, it looks like in 2009, Frogmore Cottage was 3 houses & 2 flats, which the council consented to be converted into 4 houses. The separate studio building isn't mentioned in these alterations.

In spring 2018, the application & supporting documentation says there were 7 properties associated with the planning application (5 in the main Frogmore Cottage building and 2 in the separate studio building). Property numbers 1 and 2 aren't mentioned as part of these alterations but it's indicated that they were occupied. Numbers 3, 4a, 4b and 5 were due to become:
3 x three bedroom dwellings and 1 x one bedroom dwelling

The additional documentation with this application says that the main Frogmore Cottage building's original floorpan is "almost completely unrecognisable" due to the many alterations over the years & it does mention the addition of internal walls so if H&M have removed walls to enlarge rooms, they wouldn't be damaging anything of historical importance.

 

[Nice Nofret]

In the time when 21 People where in Frogmore Cottage, it should be noted, that many people cohabited in one bedroom; only higher servents and not even all grown up children had their own bedroom but shared!


And you can be sure, there wheren't many bathrooms available - in some houses still chamberpots where in use.

 

[Spheno]

In the time when 21 People where in Frogmore Cottage, it should be noted, that many people cohabited in one bedroom; only higher servents and not even all grown up children had their own bedroom but shared!


And you can be sure, there wheren't many bathrooms available - in some houses still chamberpots where in use.

It wasn't servants. It was Grand Duchess Xenia's family: her sons, their spouses, their children.

 

[Rudolph]

21 people? That must have been nice and cozy lol.

 

[MARG]

What I was trying to convey is that FC was built as a royal retreat and while the bedrooms and reception rooms were not like BP or Windsor, they would probably been more like Frogmore House which was basically just a place to retreat and write or paint, etc. and just plain keeping out of the King's way.

 

[Lilyflo]

Frogmore Cottage has 2 floors (!), so it is approximately 12 066 sq feet (1121 m2)

I'm just checking these figures with you Rena - it's 12,066 sq ft? I don't disbelieve you but could you check your calculations?

The reason I'm asking is that the average UK home is a 3-bed, semi-detached house at 1000 - 1500 sq ft & I'd quite like to know how many of those would be equivalent to Frogmore Cottage.

 

[tommy100]

The couple have applied for retrospective planning permission to alter the planned landscaping that had been approved previously.
19/01954/FULL | External landscaping works (part retrospective) | Frogmore Cottage Frogmore Windsor SL4 2JG

The DM has an article on it but I won't post it here because it takes us down the usual rabbit hole and off topic. But in summary its believed they will have an organic vegetable patch and a tennis court.

 

[Pranter]

Really...now that's cool about the veggie patch. I wonder if Meghan plays tennis? I didn't think Harry was a player.



LaRae

 

[tommy100]

Should say that info was in the DM article not the planning docs so wouldn't be too sure either are true

 

[Pranter]

The organic veggie patch makes sense based on past comments about gardening by Meghan and I think even Harry. The tennis court, not so much.



LaRae

 

[Nice Nofret]

why does one need a planning permission for a verggy patch?

 

[Lilyflo]

The couple have applied for retrospective planning permission to alter the planned landscaping that had been approved previously.
19/01954/FULL | External landscaping works (part retrospective) | Frogmore Cottage Frogmore Windsor SL4 2JG

The DM has an article on it but I won't post it here because it takes us down the usual rabbit hole and off topic. But in summary its believed they will have an organic vegetable patch and a tennis court.

Almost everyone I know has an organic veggie patch & all of our TV gardening programmes have been featuring them for years so that's quite mainstream for the UK. A tennis court is of course only for those with the space & finances to create and maintain one but many large properties have one.

 

[Pranter]

My guess is, if this is true, it would be for the tennis court not the veggie patch.



LaRae

 

[Lilyflo]

why does one need a planning permission for a verggy patch?

I'm sure nobody needs permission to have an organic veggie patch unless it's replacing something that is a protected feature. I've previously owned a Grade II listed property & I didn't need planning permission to do anything to the garden itself but there was a stream, an orchard & some very old boundary walls that couldn't be altered without consent. The landscaping they're doing might involve walls or hedges or other features that require permission to move/change. If anyone here is a UK lawyer, I'm sure they could give you a more informed answer - mine is just based on my own experience.

 

[Rena M.]

I'm just checking these figures with you Rena - it's 12,066 sq ft? I don't disbelieve you but could you check your calculations?

Perhaps you can do it yourself ? It’s very simple and handy to know. I just came home and I have to eat something first, because right now I’m starving.


Find Frogmore Cottage in Google Maps and enlarge it. Place the cursor of your mouse on the 1 point and do right click with your mouse. Menu will open and choose measuring distances. Then place the cursor on the end point and do the left click with your mouse. The result will be displayed on the small, white pop up window below. Close this window and you can measure next distance.

 

[Rena M.]

The DM has an article on it but I won't post it here because it takes us down the usual rabbit hole and off topic. But in summary its believed they will have an organic vegetable patch and a tennis court.

There is absolutely NO room for tennis court in their garden, no way!
BTW, there IS already a tennis court on the grounds of The Home Park

 

[Tarlita]

From the look of the satellite image the tennis court is not far away at all from Harry and Meghan's home. If I lived on the windsor private estate all I would need to get around is a golf cart, as everything is so close and handy.
Thanks for Sat image Rena, very useful.

 

[Curryong]

A tennis court? As far as I know, Harry doesn't play and surely Meghan would use the court nearby. What happened to the two orangeries that the couple were proposing to have in their garden, according to the same publication!

 

[Rudolph]

The retroactive planning permission made the front page of the DM

https://twitter.com/x/status/1151962720582950918

 

[JR76]

Is a retroactive planning application actually that much of a deal? People change their minds or forget to file them all the time when doing renovation work. They get filed all the time in the endless amount of episodes of Grand Design and Property Ladder that I've seen and can't be that unusual even in the "real world". I know you risk a fine or even having to undo the work you've done, but it's not as if DDoS are the first one to do it.

 

[Chloep]

Is a retroactive planning application actually that much of a deal? People change their minds or forget to file them all the time when doing renovation work. They get filed all the time in the endless amount of episodes of Grand Design and Property Ladder that I've seen and can't be that unusual even in the "real world".

No it's not. This is nothing but an extra filling form and no big deal at all. Has been the case plenty of times in the past. Never really made it to the news. Certainly not to the front page....
__

I wonder where Meghan and Harry are planing to put this (imaginary) tennis court. I imagine levitating over the non-existent place for it?
Golly, with that kind of technology it will surely cost the taxpayers at least £107.89m.