"Revenge" by Tom Bower (2022)

[US Royal Watcher]

Harry and Meghan truly love each other, and their marriage seems pretty solid, so I don't understand the argument for delaying their marriage. The issue was that she was unhappy as a senior royal.

I think the issue was that her personality was not suited for the role - not a criticism, I wouldn't enjoy it either - so delaying her marriage to Harry would not have made any difference, in my opinion. She didn't want to make public appearances; she wanted to give issue-oriented speeches and draw attention to causes she feels strongly about. I'm not convinced that easing into royal life rather than hitting the ground running would have made a difference. The issue was the work, not her husband.

 

[Sunnystar]

One thing we're forgetting in all of this, and I'm one of the last around here to defend Meghan or her motives in any of this, is Harry. He was not about to lose Meghan once he had her committed. He'd been down that path with Cressida and Chelsy and both of them turned him down once they realized what life in the royal fishbowl was like. Even had Meghan been inclined to slow things down and live in the UK for a year after her contract for Suits was up without being engaged, I'm not sure Harry would have been okay with that. He wanted her publicly, fully committed and married quickly so that she wouldn't be able to dip out on him the way his previous longterm girlfriends had done.

 

[Somebody]

Weren't Maxima and Mary already engaged when they moved overseas? I suppose that technically there was still a risk that the wedding might be called off, but the risk was pretty low at that stage.

No, they were not. Both of them took at least a year to get to know the country and their future husband much better by moving to Europe before their engagement was announced.

After about a year of being in a long-distance relation, Máxima moved to Brussels (in March/April 2000) to be much closer to Willem-Alexander and the Netherlands. She only moved to The Hague (moving in with her future mother-in-law) after their public engagement on March 31, 2001. All in all, for about a year they lived on different continents, then they had another year to get to know each other much better living a few hours from each other, next they had a little less than a year in which they were publicly engaged and Máxima got to know the Netherlands and the Netherlands got to know her as their future princess and queen; and then they got married (February 2, 2002).

Mary moved to Europe almost two years before their engagement. They met in August 2000, and she moved to Paris in December 2001 (their relationship had become public knowledge a month prior); after about 6 months she moved to Denmark where she continued to work for another year (September 2002-September 2003) before their engagement was announced.

So both of these long-distance couples made sure that the brides understood what they were getting themselves into. So, I don't see a reason why if Meghan and Harry wanted to, they couldn't have found a way for Meghan to first understand what she was getting herself into by finding a way for her to live in the UK before becoming engaged. But it is pretty clear they didn't want to but preferred to rush into marriage - even against the advice of his elder brother who understood that it was a bit more complicated than Harry and Meghan wanted it to be.

Harry and Meghan truly love each other, and their marriage seems pretty solid, so I don't understand the argument for delaying their marriage. The issue was that she was unhappy as a senior royal.

I think the issue was that her personality was not suited for the role - not a criticism, I wouldn't enjoy it either - so delaying her marriage to Harry would not have made any difference, in my opinion. She didn't want to make public appearances; she wanted to give issue-oriented speeches and draw attention to causes she feels strongly about. I'm not convinced that easing into royal life rather than hitting the ground running would have made a difference. The issue was the work, not her husband.

The difference imho would have been that they would have known that prior to marriage and could have adjusted everybody's expectations: being clear from the start would have made a huge difference in not creating the mess that resulted from it. However, if the book is to be believed she was craving 'fame' and for 'fame' (and the resulting perks) a short stint as a senior royal was helpful.

 

[US Royal Watcher]

The difference imho would have been that they would have known that prior to marriage and could have adjusted everybody's expectations: being clear from the start would have made a huge difference in not creating the mess that resulted from it. However, if the book is to be believed she was craving 'fame' and for 'fame' (and the resulting perks) a short stint as a senior royal was helpful.

That makes sense. It's possible that if she had lived in the UK for a while, she would have had more realistic expectations and avoided some of the unhappiness. But it seems as though Harry wanted to leave before he even met Meghan and had a lot of festering issues so I am not sure it would have made that much of a difference.

 

[tommy100]

Delaying the wedding would have given time for Meghan to get to know the UK better, that is vital for being a member of the RF IMO. The book makes clear Meghan refused offers of help so I'm not sure longer would have made a difference but there were a lot of things about the UK and royal life Meghan just didn't know which didn't help her settle. Even if they followed the same timeline they could have said Meghan was going to take a year to get to know her new country and wouldn't be doing full on royal engagements but learning behind the scenes. IMO its the hollywood fame part of Meghan that didn't want to do that as it meant allowing her fame to diminish rather than building on the momentum of the engagement for even more fame and PR.
I feel teh book lays out the case that Harry wanted to leave and was unhappy and Meghan dreamed of returning to America as an 'a lister' to show off her new status. A recipe for disaster.

 

[FigTree]

If only. Such a sad situation and so easy to see how it could be avoided. The loneliest words you will ever know, if only, if only this were so.

The have two healthy children, money and their own health. They are fine. He looks miserable in public. She beams. On the surface its all the same.

 

[Prinsara]

However, if the book is to be believed she was craving 'fame' and for 'fame' (and the resulting perks) a short stint as a senior royal was helpful.

It doesn't, though. Her fame did and does come solely from being Harry's wife, not from a minute of actually working as a royal. I find it hard to believe she doesn't understand that (I'm pretty sure she does).

Given that, and that the BRF offered to have them do 'nothing' after marriage, very few engagements, or even let her keep acting, they could have chosen a much lower-key initial path (a version of HIHO! ) and Meghan would have had more time to adjust to the culture shock.

But for whatever reason, she wanted to go full tilt. (Maybe she thought it would be better for her image, not simply for fame. Or maybe she just wanted that title.) That was another (major) mistake.

 

[hereditarytitles]

It doesn't, though. Her fame did and does come solely from being Harry's wife, not from a minute of actually working as a royal. I find it hard to believe she doesn't understand that (I'm pretty sure she does).

Given that, and that the BRF offered to have them do 'nothing' after marriage, very few engagements, or even let her keep acting, they could have chosen a much lower-key initial path (a version of HIHO! ) and Meghan would have had more time to adjust to the culture shock.

But for whatever reason, she wanted to go full tilt. (Maybe she thought it would be better for her image, not simply for fame. Or maybe she just wanted that title.) That was another (major) mistake.

Many members have already written a lot , and opinions differ, thats normal.
Just my thoughts about the whole mess:

When Harry met Meghan and they fell in love and got engaged and so on, it was kind of a sensation. I was happy about it because I believed he met the woman of his life. he always seemed to be unhappy and not feeling ok in his royal role. Meghan did well in the beginning, I remember how much she was greeted and loved by the people, especially the black/mixed community, which in the UK is a big community. And I watched, really aghast, that it skipped. I really don't know how and why it did. All of a sudden the enthusiasm of people changed completely. And then, all the rest happened, as we all know. What I really am sorry for is that as a black woman who is not stupid she could have made so much changes, engaging herself for the Commonwealth and many other issues. It would have been a milestone in history, just as it was for me a milestone when Obama became the first black president in the US.
I am very disappointed about both of them. To me it looks like that they just wanted the Good Life, money, fame, a big mansion in California, next to the Hollywood stars. Harry, I dont know if he wanted that, he just wanted another life. My greatest disappointment is about her.
Hope you understand my point, since english is not my mother language I do have problems to go into the details.

 

[suztav]

Many members have already written a lot , and opinions differ, thats normal.
Just my thoughts about the whole mess:

When Harry met Meghan and they fell in love and got engaged and so on, it was kind of a sensation. I was happy about it because I believed he met the woman of his life. he always seemed to be unhappy and not feeling ok in his royal role. Meghan did well in the beginning, I remember how much she was greeted and loved by the people, especially the black/mixed community, which in the UK is a big community. And I watched, really aghast, that it skipped. I really don't know how and why it did. All of a sudden the enthusiasm of people changed completely. And then, all the rest happened, as we all know. What I really am sorry for is that as a black woman who is not stupid she could have made so much changes, engaging herself for the Commonwealth and many other issues. It would have been a milestone in history, just as it was for me a milestone when Obama became the first black president in the US.
I am very disappointed about both of them. To me it looks like that they just wanted the Good Life, money, fame, a big mansion in California, next to the Hollywood stars. Harry, I dont know if he wanted that, he just wanted another life. My greatest disappointment is about her.
Hope you understand my point, since english is not my mother language I do have problems to go into the details.

I totally agree with you. It is a HUGE missed opportunity for the communities of color in the UK/Commonwealth.

Regardless of what happened ... the perception is now reality -- they both just wanted the Good Life without the hard work and criticism. Oddly, it seems that the only thing they now have is criticism.

 

[Prinsara]

I totally agree with you. It is a HUGE missed opportunity for the communities of color in the UK/Commonwealth.

Regardless of what happened ... the perception is now reality -- they both just wanted the Good Life without the hard work and criticism. Oddly, it seems that the only thing they now have is criticism.

They both still have an exceptionally good life by almost anyone's standards.

But people who need to check social media to see what's being said about them and gain validation that way are deeply unlikely to be happy.

 

[FigTree]

They both still have an exceptionally good life by almost anyone's standards.

But people who need to check social media to see what's being said about them and gain validation that way are deeply unlikely to be happy.

They have an exceptionally good life...but unfortunately are never going to get what they want. To be taken seriously as global humanitarian. The book questions a lot. Why do they need constant validation? If you do there is an issue because you can't keep everyone happy. People will moan. And also points our pretty strongly they Harry is useless. I mean why he didn't get her help I don't know she asked herself and they said no to some upper exclusive wellness place...which is fair enough. They never said no to help. Half of themselves have been therapy.

 

[Leopoldine]

I'm having difficulty ordering this book from American sellers. Has it not been released in the States? I can't even pre-order or put it in a cart on Amazon.

 

[Ista]

I had to order it from Amazon UK, I didn't see an option to order from the US site.

 

[Gawin]

I'm having difficulty ordering this book from American sellers. Has it not been released in the States? I can't even pre-order or put it in a cart on Amazon.

It's not available for sale in the United States yet. I suggest you order a copy from Book Depository since they ship to other countries for free:

https://www.bookdepository.com/Revenge-Tom-Bower/9781788705035


ETA:As Ista pointed out it's also available from Amazon UK. I just checked and the price has been marked down. Even with shipping its cheaper than Book Depository:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Revenge-Meghan-Harry-between-Windsors/dp/1788705033/

 

[rominet09]

Many members have already written a lot , and opinions differ, thats normal.
Just my thoughts about the whole mess:

When Harry met Meghan and they fell in love and got engaged and so on, it was kind of a sensation. I was happy about it because I believed he met the woman of his life. he always seemed to be unhappy and not feeling ok in his royal role. Meghan did well in the beginning, I remember how much she was greeted and loved by the people, especially the black/mixed community, which in the UK is a big community. And I watched, really aghast, that it skipped. I really don't know how and why it did. All of a sudden the enthusiasm of people changed completely. And then, all the rest happened, as we all know. What I really am sorry for is that as a black woman who is not stupid she could have made so much changes, engaging herself for the Commonwealth and many other issues. It would have been a milestone in history, just as it was for me a milestone when Obama became the first black president in the US.
I am very disappointed about both of them. To me it looks like that they just wanted the Good Life, money, fame, a big mansion in California, next to the Hollywood stars. Harry, I dont know if he wanted that, he just wanted another life. My greatest disappointment is about her.
Hope you understand my point, since english is not my mother language I do have problems to go into the details.

I understand an I agree. I was a huge fan of theirs, but their attitude made me completely change my mind.

 

[Mirabel]

When Harry met Meghan and they fell in love and got engaged and so on, it was kind of a sensation. I was happy about it because I believed he met the woman of his life. he always seemed to be unhappy and not feeling ok in his royal role. Meghan did well in the beginning, I remember how much she was greeted and loved by the people, especially the black/mixed community, which in the UK is a big community. And I watched, really aghast, that it skipped. I really don't know how and why it did. All of a sudden the enthusiasm of people changed completely.

I don't think it was "all of a sudden."
It was over a period of time in which Meghan made it clear that she not only disliked royal life, she also disliked the UK and everything about it.

I think that was the unforgivable thing; it's hard to keep on liking someone if their dislike of you is palpable.

(For me, a huge red flag was the way in which Harry's cousins were excluded from the wedding. There was no real reason for that and it came across as petty, imo.)

 

[Mbruno]

I don't think it was "all of a sudden."
It was over a period of time in which Meghan made it clear that she not only disliked royal life, she also disliked the UK and everything about it.

I think that was the unforgivable thing; it's hard to keep on liking someone if their dislike of you is palpable.

(For me, a huge red flag was the way in which Harry's cousins were excluded from the wedding. There was no real reason for that and it came across as petty, imo.)

Meghan's official "excuse" so to speak is obviously that she doesn't dislike the UK per se, but that she was mistreated/abused there (by the press, the haters, the courtiers, etc.) to the point that she and her family would be personally at risk (either mentally or even physically) if they stayed in the UK.

Those are obviously pretty dramatic accusations, but Harry genuinely seems to believe his wife and that narrative also gave him an excuse to get out of royal life, which he wasn't comfortable with either for different reasons. It remains to be seen whether he regrets it now or will come to regret it in the future. Meghan, I think, is fine now that she is "back home" (as she said to Oprah) and basically living the life she always wanted to have, but probably would not have gotten on her own had she not married someone like Harry.

 

[Moonmaiden23]

I don't think it was "all of a sudden."
It was over a period of time in which Meghan made it clear that she not only disliked royal life, she also disliked the UK and everything about it.

I think that was the unforgivable thing; it's hard to keep on liking someone if their dislike of you is palpable.

(For me, a huge red flag was the way in which Harry's cousins were excluded from the wedding. There was no real reason for that and it came across as petty, imo.)

Several of Harry's cousins, and all of Meghan's relatives except her mother.

And yet we saw an entire contingent from A-List Hollywood, most if not all who had never even met the bride and groom

Of all the red flags I saw in the relationship, their wedding guest list was the biggest and reddest one of all.

 

[Curryong]

Meghan invited the cast and crew of Suits, and she certainly knew them very well. There were several celebrity guests known to Harry who turned up. Many celebrities who aren’t besties of the bride or groom turn up at various royal weddings in fact. And some relatives are left off the guest lists.

Apart from Oprah and possibly the George Cloonies (whom Harry and Meghan apparently knew from the London Soho Club) who was there who was unknown to the bride and/or groom?

List of wedding guests at the Sussex wedding.


https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_wedding_guests_of_Prince_Harry_and_Meghan_Markle

 

[Biri]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_wedding_guests_of_Prince_Harry_and_Meghan_Markle

As we see, Harry's cousins were NOT excluded.

 

[Hallo girl]

As we see, Harry's cousins were NOT excluded.

There are a number of family members, second cousins etc that are usually invited to most royal weddings/ events. If you think of the Queens Xmas lunch as an example , or Phillips memorial service, they are probably Harrys second cousins. It was these relatives that were omitted from the guest list.

Grandchidren of the Kents are an example,


I am not agreeing or disagreeing just saying who it was that royal watchers expected to be there.

 

[Mirabel]

There are a number of family members, second cousins etc that are usually invited to most royal weddings/ events. If you think of the Queens Xmas lunch as an example , or Phillips memorial service, they are probably Harrys second cousins. It was these relatives that were omitted from the guest list.

Grandchidren of the Kents are an example,


I am not agreeing or disagreeing just saying who it was that royal watchers expected to be there.

Yes, exactly. The extended royal family is generally included in such events, yet none of them were invited.
There was no reason for excluding them since the chapel seats 800. I am still baffled by that, it's not like they had to limit their guest list.

 

[Claire]

It was odd, especially when you compare to Eugenie's and later Ella Windsor wedding. Whatever the reason - we really will never know. However I do know that Louise and James Windsor were also not included in the original list. Many people hoped that they might be in the Wedding party, but they were not even invited.
The reason was children were not invited as guest to the wedding - there was an age limit and they were under it. I think that the Queen personally requested that they be included.

 

[yukari]

It was odd, especially when you compare to Eugenie's and later Ella Windsor wedding. Whatever the reason - we really will never know. However I do know that Louise and James Windsor were also not included in the original list. Many people hoped that they might be in the Wedding party, but they were not even invited.
The reason was children were not invited as guest to the wedding - there was an age limit and they were under it. I think that the Queen personally requested that they be included.

Well, if we compare with Eugenie's wedding, it's rather odd that neither Savannah, Isla, nor Mia was included in the wedding party. For one, if it's about age, they're older than Charlotte so either of them would be better choice. If, say, Savannah were included, maybe George and Charlotte wouldn't seem to be as isolated (they clung to their parents before and after the ceremony, unlike during Eugenie's).

 

[TLLK]

It was odd, especially when you compare to Eugenie's and later Ella Windsor wedding. Whatever the reason - we really will never know. However I do know that Louise and James Windsor were also not included in the original list. Many people hoped that they might be in the Wedding party, but they were not even invited.
The reason was children were not invited as guest to the wedding - there was an age limit and they were under it. I think that the Queen personally requested that they be included.

I had not known that Louise and James were not on the original guest list. Considering that they are Harry's first cousins that is surprising but as you mentioned there was an age limit. ? Glad that they were later included.

 

[Mbruno]

As we see, Harry's cousins were NOT excluded.

Harry's paternal first and second cousins and maternal first cousins were invited (I am referring here to Queen Elizabeth II's grandchildren, Princess Margaret's grandchildren, and Diana's nieces/nephew). His paternal second cousins once removed (i.e. the children of the Duke of Gloucester, the Duke of Kent, Prince Michael, and Princess Alexandra) and his paternal third cousins (the grandchildren of the Kents of the Gloucesters) were not, although they are normally included in royal events. Harry's younger first cousins once removed (Princess Anne's grandchildren) weren't invited either, but his father's first cousins (Princess Margaret's children, of whom Harry is also a first cousin once removed) were.

To be fair, the guest list is compatible with the "unofficial" definition now of the Royal Family, i.e. the descendants of King George VI only plus the other grandchildren in male line of King George V.

And, just to add some context, "third cousin" is the same degree of kinship between Queen Elizabeth II and, for example, the King of Sweden, the Queen of Denmark, the former King of Spain (Juan Carlos I), and the former King of the Belgians (Albert II). I don't think it is shocking not to invite third cousins to your wedding, but opinions may vary.

 

[Moonmaiden23]

Meghan invited the cast and crew of Suits, and she certainly knew them very well. There were several celebrity guests known to Harry who turned up. Many celebrities who aren’t besties of the bride or groom turn up at various royal weddings in fact. And some relatives are left off the guest lists.

Apart from Oprah and possibly the George Cloonies (whom Harry and Meghan apparently knew from the London Soho Club) who was there who was unknown to the bride and/or groom?

List of wedding guests at the Sussex wedding.


https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_wedding_guests_of_Prince_Harry_and_Meghan_Markle

Idris Elba and his wife. Oprah Winfrey and Gayle King only met the Sussexes in the runup to the wedding. The Clooneys told other wedding guests who asked how they knew the Sussexes "we DON'T" according to Tom Bowers.

If this story is untrue, why have the Clooneys and/or their reps not denied it?

Anyway why did ANY of these people out rank family members? I understand why Meghan did not invite her father and half siblings. But what about the diplomat uncle who was instrumental in securing her the internship in South America?

Where were Doria's side of the family?

 

[suztav]

Idris Elba and his wife. Oprah Winfrey and Gayle King only met the Sussexes in the runup to wedding. The Clooneys told other wedding guests who asked how the know the Sussexes "we DON'T" according to Tom Bowers.

If this story is untrue, why have the Clooneys and/or their reps not denied it?

Anyway why did ANY of these people out rank family members? I understand why Meghan did not invite her father and half siblings. But what about the diplomat uncle who was instrumental in securing her the internship in South America?

Where were Doria's side of the family?

I always thought the seating was odd —- and very telling!

 

[FigTree]

Idris Elba and his wife. Oprah Winfrey and Gayle King only met the Sussexes in the runup to wedding. The Clooneys told other wedding guests who asked how the know the Sussexes "we DON'T" according to Tom Bowers.

If this story is untrue, why have the Clooneys and/or their reps not denied it?

Anyway why did ANY of these people out rank family members? I understand why Meghan did not invite her father and half siblings. But what about the diplomat uncle who was instrumental in securing her the internship in South America?

Where were Doria's side of the family?

Serena Williams and Meghan don't seem close either. Where is she now? Probably was just an acquaintance. People can do what they want.

Also Carey Mulligan was not a friend of Meghan's. She knows Harry l, or did know him, through charity work.

 

[Somebody]

Harry's paternal first and second cousins and maternal first cousins were invited (I am referring here to Queen Elizabeth II's grandchildren, Princess Margaret's grandchildren, and Diana's nieces/nephew). His paternal second cousins once removed (i.e. the children of the Duke of Gloucester, the Duke of Kent, Prince Michael, and Princess Alexandra) and his paternal third cousins (the grandchildren of the Kents of the Gloucesters) were not, although they are normally included in royal events. Harry's younger first cousins once removed (Princess Anne's grandchildren) weren't invited either, but his father's first cousins (Princess Margaret's children, of whom Harry is also a first cousin once removed) were.

To be fair, the guest list is compatible with the "unofficial" definition now of the Royal Family, i.e. the descendants of King George VI only plus the other grandchildren in male line of King George V.

And, just to add some context, "third cousin" is the same degree of kinship between Queen Elizabeth II and, for example, the King of Sweden, the Queen of Denmark, the former King of Spain (Juan Carlos I), and the former King of the Belgians (Albert II). I don't think it is shocking not to invite third cousins to your wedding, but opinions may vary.

It's not shocking if you don't know them and organize a small wedding - but his is not a 'normal' family but the royal family that does interact with each other - probably because the 'first cousins' generation is still at the helm. Moreover, they organized a really large wedding on a royal venue that included guests they didn't know at all - while Harry has known these third cousins all his life. It is even more shocking if you have lived a significant part of your life as neighbors... in the case of Lord Frederick Windsor and Lady Gabriella Windsor/Kingston.

So, there wasn't really a reason to actively exclude them. They would normally have been on the guest list as for family events of this size the BRF would invite all George V's descendants by his sons (as they do at Trooping and the Christmas lunch each year).

Serena Williams and Meghan don't seem close either. Where is she now? Probably was just an acquaintance. People can do what they want.

Also Carey Mulligan was not a friend of Meghan's. She knows Harry l, or did know him, through charity work.

IIRC the book specifically stated that Serena Williams herself claimed she wasn't a friend but indeed just an acquaintance of Meghan.