Order of Precedence 1: Ending 2022

[padams2359]

I'd say the Private Order of Precedence goes like this:
- The Duke of Edinburgh
- The Prince of Wales
- The Duke of Cambridge
- Prince Henry of Wales
- The Duke of York
- The Earl of Wessex *
- The Duke of Gloucester
- The Duke of Kent
- Timothy Lawrence

* Viscount Severn is not included because he is not of age yet[/QUOTE]

Wouldn't Viscount Lindley be ahead of the Dukes of G & K and Timothy Lawrence?

 

[Artemisia]

Wouldn't Viscount Lindley be ahead of the Dukes of G & K and Timothy Lawrence?

Normally, in the Official Order of Precedence the Sovereign's nephews (such as Viscount Linley) come ahead of the Sovereign's cousins (the Dukes of Gloucester and Kent), and the husband of the Sovereign's daughter isn't included at all. However, I would say the Duke of Gloucester and the Duke of Kent have been given preference over Viscount Linley as working members of the Royal Family who also have the style of Royal Highness and title of Princes.

Since no word has ever been given on the hierarchy in the Private Order of Precedence (or indeed, we don't even know it exists in the first place), this is all speculation on my part. The only indirect confirmation of an existence of such an Order comes from the fact that William and Harry often take precedence over their uncles (which shouldn't be the case in the Official Order, where the Sovereign's son take precedence over the Sovereign's grandsons).

 

[HRHThePrince]

Does anyone know what the Order of Precedence was when Queen Victoria ascended the throne? I'm a bit curious regarding her mother's place in the precedence. I know by law and statute, Queen Adelaide came after Victoria.

 

[Ladislaja]

I have a question about the order of precedence. If a peeress in her own right married a peer, would her precedence stay the same?

 

[VictoriaB]

I have a question about the order of precedence. If a peeress in her own right married a peer, would her precedence stay the same?

I'm not sure what would happen if her husband's title was higher than her's but if her's is higher than her husband's, she takes the precedence that goes with her own title.

An example of this is Countess Mountbatten of Burma. She was married to Baron Brabourne when her father was murdered and she succeeded to the Earldom. Since then she has been known formally as Countess Mountbatten rather than Lady Brabourne - even before her husband died and her son succeeded to the Brabourne title.

 

[NGalitzine]

I have a question about the order of precedence. If a peeress in her own right married a peer, would her precedence stay the same?

I guess that would depend on if her husband had a higher title. If his title was higher I would imagine that is what she would go with but if lower she would keep her own higher precedence.

When Lady Patricia Mountbatten married Lord Brabourne her precedence dropped from being that of an earls daughter to that of a Barons wife. When she became Countess Mountbatten of Burma her precedence became higher than that of her Baron husband.

 

[branchg]

I have a question about the order of precedence. If a peeress in her own right married a peer, would her precedence stay the same?

Her own personal precedence, if higher than her husband's, would remain the same. But wives take the precedence of their husband, so when together, it would reflect his title unless a royal warrant provides otherwise.

 

[Rudolph]

So tonight I met the Queen, the Duke of Edinburgh & Prince William. Amazing. #TechAtPalace

https://twitter.com/kierondonoghue/status/476095625080373248/photo/1

Its appears at least for private precedence the Duke of Cambridge is ahead of his uncle Andrew.

 

[Skippyboo]

William was after his grandparents in the receiving line also.

 

[Molly2101]

I thought William was meant to be AFTER his uncles if his father wasn't present? Meh. The Queen makes it up as she goes along.

 

[Spheno]

look at Court Circular The British Royals Message Board: Court Circular 6 June 2014

It's very clear that prince William is ahead of his uncles

HÔTEL DE CHAROST, RUE DU FAUBOURG ST. HONORÉ, PARI: The Queen and The Duke of Edinburgh this morning .....
CLARENCE HOUSE: The Prince of Wales and The Duchess of Cornwall this morning attended....
KENSINGTON PALACE: The Duke and Duchess of Cambridge this afternoon ....
BUCKINGHAM PALACE: The Duke of York, Chairman of the Trustees, this evening ....
BUCKINGHAM PALACE: The Earl of Wessex, Trustee, this morning ....
The Countess of Wessex, President, the Royal Cornwall Agricultural Association, today attended ....
BUCKINGHAM PALACE: The Princess Royal, Patron, Sense International, this morning attended ....
ST. JAMES'S PALACE: The Duke of Kent, Colonel-in-Chief, The Royal Regiment of Fusiliers, this morning ....
THATCHED HOUSE LODGE RICHMOND PARK: Princess Alexandra this evening attended....

 

[Pranter]

I don't know how Andrew would be ahead of William...William is the son of the heir. Andrew is merely the brother of the heir.

LaRae

 

[Iluvbertie]

I don't know how Andrew would be ahead of William...William is the son of the heir. Andrew is merely the brother of the heir.

LaRae

William is merely the grandson of The Queen's eldest son while Andrew is one of her own sons - a child she carried, nurtured and raised - is another way of expressing it.

The CC usually lists engagements in order of succession which isn't the same as order of precedence.

There have been occasions when I have seen Harry's engagements listed ahead of Charles' for instance - along with the Duke of Gloucester and Princess Anne - depends on what the engagement is.

 

[AdmirerUS]

I thought William was meant to be AFTER his uncles if his father wasn't present? Meh. The Queen makes it up as she goes along.

I said a while ago here that they follow the rules until they don't. There are all these "this unless" clauses that apply. That's how it is. I've given up on this issue and have decided to remain blissfully ignorant.

 

[Skippyboo]

Court Circular aside, Rudolph's post had a picture of the invitation which listed William ahead Andrew. Whoever does the invitations in the Royal Household, would list it correctly I assume. Also photos of the event, show William after his grandparents but ahead of his uncle as they walked through the line of guests being greeted.

 

[kbk]

Artemisia and padams2359, you both forgot Prince Michael in "your" private precedence lists! Or maybe you think (or know) that he is not included in the Private Precedence?

Also, what about the Dowager Countess of Harewood? If the late Earl had a place in the precedence among the Royal Family (at least that official one), as a royal cousin of the Queen, his widow should be there also until her death or remarriage. I know that she does not take any part in the life of the firm (has she any contact with her late husband's royal relatives??), so my question here is only theoretical, but it's quite interesting to me.

 

[Duc_et_Pair]

The funeral of the late Queen Elizabeth and the wedding of Prince William have shown that the Order of Precedence is taken with some easiness and is ultimately what it is: a guide. Not a prescription.

These days, when world leader Angela says Barack against another world leader, or are going to join in a rowing boat "casually dressed", the importance of precedence is under erosion. There is some "automatic" order: the Prince of Wales and his spouse will follow the Queen and the Duke. And the Duke and Duchess of Cambridge as well Prince Harry of Wales are in that top pack too. The rest has figured somewhat, by experience, by taking one's age, position, closeness to the Queen, a sort of natural precedence. There is no courtier sweating and almost fainting, trying to convince members of the royal family that someone ranked no 17 whould swap urgently with someone ranked no 14...

 

[LeDerius]

The order of precedence is tricky: By Parliament, The Prince of Wales outranks his father; we all know that the Duke of Edinburgh (from the Queens point of view), outranks The Prince of Wales.

In addition from what I understand, when it comes to Precedence, ROYAL DUKES, outrank royal princes. This would mean that Prince Harry comes after his Uncle and before his cousins.

 

[Iluvbertie]

The Queen issued specific orders regarding the precedence of Philip which makes it clear that - other then those specified occasions when the Prince of Wales must take precedence then Philip takes precedence immediately after The Queen - giving him the same status a Queen Consort would have.

 

[HisLegendaryMajest]

This might seem weird and i don't know if its been answered anywhere, but what happens if all the members of the Royal Family are present? Do husbands and wives just stand next to their partner and whoever was born into the family determines their placing in line?

 

[Osipi]

This might seem weird and i don't know if its been answered anywhere, but what happens if all the members of the Royal Family are present? Do husbands and wives just stand next to their partner and whoever was born into the family determines their placing in line?

You've pretty much nailed it on the head. Right now if all were in attendance, lets say at a formal dinner or a family wedding, the first to arrive and be seated would the from the lowest pecking order to the highest (except for in the case of a royal wedding where the Queen enters before the bridal party itself).

Highest to lowest and I recall right now would be:

Queen Elizabeth II and The Duke of Edinburgh
The Prince of Wales and The Duchess of Cornwall
The Duke and Duchess of Cambridge (and children if they're in attendance)
Prince Harry
The Duke of York and his daughters
The Earl and Countess of Wessex (and children)
The Princess Royal and Tim Laurence
Extended family members (not sure of the ranking here)

It may not be the exact order in the private order of precedence but that's something we never really see. Basically what we see is the order of precedence as a familial grouping

I'm sure there are others that know far more than I do and can elaborate and/or correct where I'm wrong.

 

[Skippyboo]

It's the Linleys and Chattos after Anne's family, then the Gloucesters and the Duke of Kent's , Prince Michael of Kent's and then Princess Alexandra's.


Sent from my iPhone using The Royals Community

 

[Duc_et_Pair]

This might seem weird and i don't know if its been answered anywhere, but what happens if all the members of the Royal Family are present? Do husbands and wives just stand next to their partner and whoever was born into the family determines their placing in line?

The spouses share their husbands' rank.

The "Iron" precedence is when all 6 are attending:

The Sovereign
The Sovereign's Consort
The Heir
The Heir's consort
The eldest child of the Heir
The consort to the eldest child of the Heir

The rest of the family follows them in a mix of order of succession and anciennity.

 

[Bryce]

There are various orders of precedence (OofP) for various functions.
There are private OofP and public OofP.

From the British Monachy website:

"Precedence determines the seniority of members of the Royal Family at official events and is influenced by a variety of laws, and by custom and tradition. Precedence among members of the Royal Family at private events is a matter for The Queen's discretion."

One good example where you might see this is at a commemorative church service.
Usually, the Royal Family proceeds into the church in reverse OofP.

Therefore, they would enter as follows:

The children of Princess Alexandra of Kent
Princess Alexandra
The children of Prince and Princess Michael of Kent
Prince and Princess Michael of Kent
The children of Duke and Duchess of Kent
The Duke and Duchess of Kent
The children of Duke and Duchess of Gloucester
The Duke and Duchess of Gloucester
The Children of Sarah Armstrong-Jones and Daniel Chatto
Sarah Armstrong-Jones and Daniel Chatto
The children of Lord and Lady Linley
Lord and Lady Linley
The children of The Princess Royal
The Princess Royal and Vice-Admiral Sir Timothy Laurence
The children of Earl and Countess of Wessex
The Earl and Countess of Wessex
The children of Duke of York
The Duke of York
Prince Henry of Wales
The Duck and Duchess of Cambridge
The Prince of Wales and the Duchess of Cornwall
HM The Queen and The Duke of Edinburgh

(I have not included everyone grand-kids etc. but I think you get the idea)

This also may change given that there is no longer a preference to the male line.

This order may also get mixed up if, for example, there was no lining-up of the family before they proceed to their seats. You may get the Kents and Gloucesters arriving together or Princess Alexandra arriving later - the more "minor" royals would not wait to take their seats if they were "out of order".

The "senior" royals do try to get it right as that is part of their job.

Even the Queen will "forgo" her precedence for weddings (where the bride comes in last) and often for funerals where the principal mourners are given preference.

PS when they leave the church by OofP from top down.

 

[Bryce]

The "Iron" precedence is when all 6 are attending:

The Sovereign
The Sovereign's Consort
The Heir
The Heir's consort
The eldest child of the Heir
The consort to the eldest child of the Heir

The rest of the family follows them in a mix of order of succession and anciennity.

One caveat to this "Iron" precedence is if, for example The Prince of Wales takes precedence by statute (law) over The Duke of Edinburgh (for example) whose precedence was granted by and Order-in-Council.

 

[Bryce]

Thanks Skippyboo - I have edited my list

It may not be the exact order in the private order of precedence but that's something we never really see. Basically what we see is the order of precedence as a familial grouping

Here is a great little clip showing an informal gathering of the Royal Family.

You will notice that everyone will acknowledge The Queen and Queen Elizabeth with a nod and a curtsy but everyone else is very informal.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UNtThrUJOJw

 

[Princess Robijn]

A great video, thanks for posting. It was interesting to watch.

 

[tommy100]

And i think IMO that sums up the Royal family's attitude, the Queen should be acknowledged and respected and maybe Philip as well but after that people aren't really going to worry about who curtsey's or bows to who at a family event where everyone is present and chatting to everyone (and to be fair could anyone keep up with who they should or should not curtsey to??)

 

[Pranter]

You know...and I may have just forgotten...but I don't remember ever seeing 'the boys' making a nod to their father...is it done and I've just missed/forgotten it or has the PoW just not required it?


LaRae

 

[Ish]

You know...and I may have just forgotten...but I don't remember ever seeing 'the boys' making a nod to their father...is it done and I've just missed/forgotten it or has the PoW just not required it?





LaRae

I don't think it's done. The family doesn't seem to really do it with anyone other than the Queen, DoE, and when she was alive the Queen Mother.

I would expect that to continue when Charles is King; people will bow/curtesy to him and Camilla, and the DoE if he's still alive, but not William or Kate. When William is King he and Kate will be bowed/curtseyed to (and likely Camilla if she's still alive), but by George.

I could be wrong, but I don't think we see other royals bow/curtesy to Victoria/Daniel, Haakon/Mette-Marie, Frederik/Mary, Alois/Sophie, or Guillaume//Stephanie, let alone the younger heir apparents.