Divorce For Sheikh Mohammed Bin Rashid & Princess Haya

[Duke of Marmalade]

On the contrary - in the eyes of many countries it's Princess Haya that have abducted her children by removing them out of their home country without the permission of the other parent.

Yes, this is what I meant, SM suing Haya for child abduction, because their home is Dubai. It would be the same for Joe Average, nobody can move children without consent of the other parent, let alone when the other parent is SM.
Whether Haya had good reasons to do what she did, either the court will decide or the parents come to an agreement.

 

[sm1939]

I know we don’t know what the actually story is behind this, hopefully the Princess can live were she wants to live with her children.

 

[Ista]

Unfortunately, my suspicion is that the two children will become the bargaining chips that Haya will have to use to ensure her own freedom and safety. SM clearly wants them back, and has positioned himself as the wronged party. Whether he wants Haya back under his control is less clear, but I would not be at all surprised if the children end up as collateral damage during the negotiations. SM may very well be extremely fond of them, but considering how he is known to have treated Latifa, I wouldn't want to be in Jalila's shoes after she becomes a young woman.

 

[Duc_et_Pair]

I know we don’t know what the actually story is behind this, hopefully the Princess can live were she wants to live with her children.

And the father? They are as much his children.

 

[Ista]

And the father? They are as much his children.

A father who has a very sketchy record as to how he treats at least some of his children. The long term health and well being of the children should be a consideration.

 

[fandesacs2003]

I think the most important weapon in Haya’s hands is the Sheikha Latifa story, and if I understood well, her sister's also, some decade ago.
It shows a man who might of course love his kids, but in his personal special way, including not accepting adults choice of life and freedom. Abducting his adults daughters and obliging them to live sequestrated in Dubai, can create serious fears of how he will treat Jalila and maybe also Zayeed, if one day in their adult life they disagree with him and they choose maybe to live with they mum in Europe.
I'm not lawyer, but I believe that an intelligent one can easily use this point, firstly to explain Haya’s act to take her kids out of Dubai, and also to explain her fears.
Last point, do we really know if she went out of Dubai secretely? Family often travels in Europe. For instance they were all in Ascot often. She might have normally traveled in Europe with the kids, on view of all going to an event, and when in Europe she managed to disappear. In this case she cannot be blamed for traveling the kids without permission. She is blamed for not returning them back.

 

[jacqui24]

It can still be child abduction even if she had permission to travel to Europe for vacation. It has obviously gone beyond what he agreed to.

It’s going to take a lot for a court to decide the father can’t at least have visitation rights to his children. And let’s not forget the complication that they aren’t UK citizens or residents at this point in time.

 

[fandesacs2003]

I don't think that Haya would like SM would not have any visit right. What she would propose IMHO is that he can visit his kids only in European neutral territory and always in presence of third neutral parties. This happens very often in case of divorces of average people and it is fully feasible, despite it hurts a lot the egoism.

 

[Duke of Marmalade]

Unfortunately, my suspicion is that the two children will become the bargaining chips that Haya will have to use to ensure her own freedom and safety. SM clearly wants them back, and has positioned himself as the wronged party. Whether he wants Haya back under his control is less clear, but I would not be at all surprised if the children end up as collateral damage during the negotiations. SM may very well be extremely fond of them, but considering how he is known to have treated Latifa, I wouldn't want to be in Jalila's shoes after she becomes a young woman.

The first documented problem was not Latifa, but Shamsa in 2001. She basically did the same thing, ran away, her father brought her back, and 'vanished' in Dubai, UK police was involved as it happened in Newmarket.

That was well before Haya married Sheikh Mohammed and had children with him. So she basically knew what would happen to any child that does not comply with the rules of Al Maktoum, yet she had no problem with that, married him and even had children. All this could not have come as a surprise, including the Latifa case.

 

[fandesacs2003]

Thanks a lot @Duke of Marmalade. It is a shocking story, for both the sisters. Is Samsa still alive? Does she have a family life in Dubai? Or we might suspect that she lost her life because she disagreed with her father.
The UK police was involved, was is any official case opened? What the result? Or UK simply accepted that a person can abduct people in their own territory without being bothered simply because this person is very rich?
If I was Haya I would not trust the same country for protecting me in this case

 

[Reinosa]

A question: are Shamsa and Latifa both daughters of Sheikha Hind?

 

[ladongas]

So a person who is known to imprison and torture his children should be allowed to have the chance to do it again? Regardless of what the mother may or may not have known, that doesn’t mean the children should have to suffer their father’s evil intent.

 

[Duke of Marmalade]

A question: are Shamsa and Latifa both daughters of Sheikha Hind?

Neither is Sheikha Hind's daughter.

Thanks a lot @Duke of Marmalade. It is a shocking story, for both the sisters. Is Samsa still alive? Does she have a family life in Dubai? Or we might suspect that she lost her life because she disagreed with her father.
The UK police was involved, was is any official case opened? What the result? Or UK simply accepted that a person can abduct people in their own territory without being bothered simply because this person is very rich?
If I was Haya I would not trust the same country for protecting me in this case

Info about Shamsa's case
https://www.theguardian.com/uk/2001/dec/10/jamiewilson.stuartmillar


Sheikh Mohammed is extremely important for the UK, the racing industry kind of depends on him and his money. The saying always was, when the Sheikh sneezes, Newmarket gets a cold.

 

[Duke of Marmalade]

So a person who is known to imprison and torture his children should be allowed to have the chance to do it again? Regardless of what the mother may or may not have known, that doesn’t mean the children should have to suffer their father’s evil intent.

That is for a court of law to decide. In Dubai, the law is Sheikh Mohammed himself, therefore there is no court case regarding Latifa, but since Shamsa times have changed, there is social media, the public pressure is different. Still, all he needs to do is trying to justify himself. There won't be any court case in his home country.


Different in the UK, a court case would be extremely dirty and I guess everyone will try to settle this issue out of court. Nobody wants a public fight and if the Sheikh loses out and pulls his money out etc that will bring everyone in a very awkward position. Haya did not get into this situation out of the blue, she was an active part of how her husband handles his business for many many years.

 

[fandesacs2003]

A question: are Shamsa and Latifa both daughters of Sheikha Hind?

No, both are daughters of the Algerian wife of SM. I don't know very well details, and I don't know if this lady is still in Dubai and if she reacts to what happened to her 2 daughters.

 

[Duke of Marmalade]

Bodyguard Russell Flowers is the ex-soldier at the centre of Princess Haya's £4.5bn divorce from Dubai ruler Sheikh Maktoum

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...naway-Dubai-Princess-Haya-centre-divorce.html

I am really surprised that this marriage is considered legal in a british court of law?
Really curious if we see some papers surfacing soon.

 

[Al_bina]

Bodyguard Russell Flowers is the ex-soldier at the centre of Princess Haya's £4.5bn divorce from Dubai ruler Sheikh Maktoum

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...naway-Dubai-Princess-Haya-centre-divorce.html

I am really surprised that this marriage is considered legal in a british court of law?
Really curious if we see some papers surfacing soon.

I am surprised to learn that the bodyguard in question does exist. According to Al-Akbar newspaper, Princess Haya's escape was organised by Crown Prince Mohammed bin Zayed and King Abdullah as a part of power struggle in UAE. https://al-akhbar.com/Yemen/273303

As for the marriage, the UK legal system has enough loopholes/interpretations to attend to needs of wealthy people.

 

[JR76]

I am really surprised that this marriage is considered legal in a british court of law?

The marriage is apparently legal. I found this in a pamphlet on polygamy published by The House of Commons in 2018.
"In a written answer in April 2008, Lord Hunt of Kings Heath, then a junior Justice Minister, set out the conditions and reasons for recognition of a polygamous marriage: For a polygamous marriage to be considered valid in the UK, the parties must be domiciled in a country where polygamous marriage is permitted, and must have entered into the marriage in that country. Provided the parties follow the necessary requirements under the law of the country in question, the marriage would be recognised in England and Wales."

 

[MARG]

I am surprised to learn that the bodyguard in question does exist. According to Al-Akbar newspaper, Princess Haya's escape was organised by Crown Prince Mohammed bin Zayed and King Abdullah as a part of power struggle in UAE. https://al-akhbar.com/Yemen/273303

As for the marriage, the UK legal system has enough loopholes/interpretations to attend to needs of wealthy people.

If that is the case then what is happening in London is a convenient sideshow. However, I do find the identification of the Bodyguard and the salacious implications incredibly dangerous to him. If this a Middle-East power game, it would be unfortunate if this man were to suffer harm because of it.

 

[Ista]

I am surprised to learn that the bodyguard in question does exist. According to Al-Akbar newspaper, Princess Haya's escape was organised by Crown Prince Mohammed bin Zayed and King Abdullah as a part of power struggle in UAE. https://al-akhbar.com/Yemen/273303

As for the marriage, the UK legal system has enough loopholes/interpretations to attend to needs of wealthy people.

How reliable is Al-Akbar newspaper?

 

[Al_bina]

How reliable is Al-Akbar newspaper?

It is impossible for me to determine how accurate Al-Akbar newspaper is. It appears to be from Beirut. At the same time, the claims made in the article are not far-fetched. Reportedly Crown Prince Mohammed bin Zayed and Sheikh Mohammed bin Rashid Al Maktoum have differences over how to handle Yemen and Qatar.

 

[Ista]

Thank you for the information. So it sounds as though there may be quite a few layers to what at first look appears to be a much simpler story. Very interesting.

And I agree with Marg that the bodyguard needs to be watching his back.

 

[sam12]

Name and pictures of the bodyguard are also published in the Daily Mail.

 

[LadyFinn]

No, both are daughters of the Algerian wife of SM. I don't know very well details, and I don't know if this lady is still in Dubai and if she reacts to what happened to her 2 daughters.

Here is a photo of 12 years old Latifa with her mother Houria Lamara. And a photo of young Houria Lamara. Latifa entrusted photos and videos of her family to her close friends before her escape attempt with the instructions to use them as necessary.
MOTHERS DAY CALLS TO MOTHER OF KIDNAPPED PRINCESS LATIFA TO... - Detained International

Statement from Cptn Herve Jaubert on the custody battle between Sheikh Mohammed and his escaped wife Princess Haya
Captain Herve Jaubert is the former French spy who masterminded Sheikha Latifa's doomed escape attempt. He is her official representative and closest confidant. He felt obliged in this respect to speak out on her behalf in regards to the upcoming custody and divorce battle between Sheikh Mohammed and his escaped wife, Princess Haya
...
“It is clear to me and other experienced observers that Latifa Al Maktoum is being detained incommunicado and undoubtedly forcibly put under psychotic drugs the same way Shamsa was, and therefore is prevented from testifying before the UK court in a custody hearing between her father and Princess Haya, her step mother.
“The UK courts should bear in mind when determining Sheikh Mohammed’s suit for custody over his and Princess Haya’s children that this is a man who kidnapped his own daughters because no legal process could return them to him. This is a man who has used psychotic drugs on at least three of his daughters to subdue them. This is a man who has jailed his own daughters and even had them tortured.
“Sheikh Mohammed disregards any foreign laws when they don't fit his agenda. The same way he disregarded UK laws to kidnap Shamsa in Cambridge, and the same way he disregarded international laws (in International Waters) to kidnap Latifa from a vessel under US jurisdiction.
“It is inconceivable to me that any court in Great Britain, free from undue political influence, could grant custody of those children to Sheikh Mohammed under any circumstances. If custody was granted I do not believe that Princess Haya would ever see her children again.
“Even if partial or shared custody were granted, I am certain that the first time the children went to the UAE they would become captives and never allowed to see their mother, Princess Haya, again.”
Jaubert's whole statement
Statement from Cptn Herve Jaubert on the custody battle between... - Detained In Dubai

 

[Duke of Marmalade]

Thanks Lady Finn and also JR76 for the statement on polygamous marriages.

That court case will bring the UK and their high profile representatives, including HM, in a very, very awkward position.

 

[kathia_sophia]

What? He even tortured his daughters? Psychotic drugs too? If all of this is true, he is not a good man. No. He is not a good human being. Poor children! No wonder the Crown Prince and his brothers married their cousins (that they didn't love) without any protests. Who knows what this man could do to his sons if one of them went against his word! Dear lord!

 

[fandesacs2003]

Is the hearing gonna be public? What does the UK law say?
According to some press articles Princess Haya carries also a British passport. I'm wondering if her kids also. Because in this case it might change the Court's decision.

 

[MARG]

That would be tricky. Correct me please if I am wrong, but I believe custody cases are held 'in camera' as they are here. I am not sure about divorce procedures per se but perhaps someone from the UK could clarify the situation.

 

[tommy100]

I don't believe court cases for divorce and custody cases which are heard by the Family Court here in the UK are public in the usual sense of the word. There are no cameras in court etc, at the most we get the written judgement. I'm happy to be corrected in someone knows more.

 

[Reinosa]

que
“It is inconceivable to me that any court in Great Britain, free from undue political influence, could grant custody of those children to Sheikh Mohammed under any circumstances. If custody was granted I do not believe that Princess Haya would ever see her children again.
“Even if partial or shared custody were granted, I am certain that the first time the children went to the UAE they would become captives and never allowed to see their mother, Princess Haya, again.”

This is the terrible truth, I think.