Crown Princess Mary, Current Events 5: September 2005 - May 2006

[SpiffyBallerina]

Yeah, ok....and that's really Mary's fault

"MII"

I never said it was her fault - it's obviously not. However, she's not stupid. She CAN control the press by determining in what events she will and will not participate. CP Mary is no idiot and she knows that fashion gets the most press. She could easily choose to channel that attention into something else. People are not just victims of the press - the people within the household are adept at trying to manipulate\control coverage so it comes out as favorable to the patron.

And yes, I do say that Mary seems a spoiled brat sometimes because she seems aloof and distant whenever she doesn't feel like being bothered. The defense that she's a person too doesn't count for much these days because she knew what she was getting into with all its responsibilities, and I find it repulsive to pity a person who has made a choice and then seems upset when it isn't exactly what she wants all the time. She has more than anyone else can dare to dream about, so the smiles for the press, even if she's not in the mood, are the least she can do. Besides, the other CPs of Europe are under just as much pressure as CP Mary, and I don't get the annoyed princess act from any of them. I'm not even a fan of all European CPs, but they at least put on a good act. CP Mary's attitude is a sense I get from watching videos, reading interviews, seeing countless photographs, etc. Since that's all we have to go on, I believe my opinion is just as valuable as someone else's and I don't think I should be mocked for it.

I don't know if she is or is not a "brat," but I'm saying that's the image she's projecting. It doesn't really help to try to use someone's own words against them when, in context, the words are a part of an entire argument point which I've already stated is something that has just as much value as anyone else's opinion here.

 

[gattica28]

Annoyed princess?...spoiled brat?...aloof and distant????!!!! I have seen numerous photos, videos and interviws of Mary being very joyous, happy, laughing and thoroughly enjoying her official role as Crown Princess of Denmark! Of course, when she's happy and smiling while carrying out her duties, she's then accused of being an attention seeker! Mary just can't win...she's damned if she does and damned if she doesn't. And the definition of "brat" is that of a spoiled, ill-mannered child! A definition that does not apply to Crown Princess Mary at all...if it did, the media in Denmark, Australia and the rest of the world would have eaten her alive! It would have been all over the media!
As for Mary being a patron of Danish fashion...this is one of the most important and growing industries in Denmark that provides a lot of jobs and contributes to the Danish economy...The late Diana, Princess of Wales was famous for her interest in fashion and that contributed to British Fashion designers becoming known all over the world! The Copenhagen International Fashion Fair of which Mary is patron has grown to become one of the largest events in Europe...it is bringing more focus and media attention to Denmark! Even Crown Prince Frederik is a patron of some danish designers of furniture etc and Princess Alexandra also attended Danish fashion events as well!

 

[pollyemma]

I never said it was her fault - it's obviously not. However, she's not stupid. She CAN control the press by determining in what events she will and will not participate. CP Mary is no idiot and she knows that fashion gets the most press. She could easily choose to channel that attention into something else. People are not just victims of the press - the people within the household are adept at trying to manipulate\control coverage so it comes out as favorable to the patron.

And yes, I do say that Mary seems a spoiled brat sometimes because she seems aloof and distant whenever she doesn't feel like being bothered. The defense that she's a person too doesn't count for much these days because she knew what she was getting into with all its responsibilities, and I find it repulsive to pity a person who has made a choice and then seems upset when it isn't exactly what she wants all the time. She has more than anyone else can dare to dream about, so the smiles for the press, even if she's not in the mood, are the least she can do. Besides, the other CPs of Europe are under just as much pressure as CP Mary, and I don't get the annoyed princess act from any of them. I'm not even a fan of all European CPs, but they at least put on a good act. CP Mary's attitude is a sense I get from watching videos, reading interviews, seeing countless photographs, etc. Since that's all we have to go on, I believe my opinion is just as valuable as someone else's and I don't think I should be mocked for it.

I don't know if she is or is not a "brat," but I'm saying that's the image she's projecting. It doesn't really help to try to use someone's own words against them when, in context, the words are a part of an entire argument point which I've already stated is something that has just as much value as anyone else's opinion here.

Spiffy Ballerina, thank you! you've articulated it perfectly!

 

[auntie]

What Mary truly is or isn't, is something we will never know. MII, you say youv'e met her, she might be so capable of putting a good face in public, and you won't know the difference. The rest is left to our speculations. From what I've read,and spoke to people worldwide, is that people doubt the "by chance" meeting, or that she didn't know who he was, and her persistence in pursuing her goal. Fine most of us would try to catch a CP wouldn't we? But in what way?! Some people, (and I'm not saying Mary is) are so manipulative and ambitious that they get caught up in the act, untill it becomes part of themselves!

Again, from what I can see Mary and Fred are truly happy, but the whole "being perfect" princess in itself shows that something is wrong. Someone who is comfortable with him/herself will not fear so much to make a minor mistake or be natural (take Camilla, MMarit, even Maxima). The last sentence is my opinion and I am entitled to make it!

 

[Margrethe II]

MII, you say youv'e met her, she might be so capable of putting a good face in public, and you won't know the difference

Indeed, I have Auntie.

And she is not a person of insincerity.

"MII"

 

[gattica28]

Auntie...who are these people you have spoken to worldwide? Persons who post on other internet message boards perhaps? Mary herself said that in the first few minutes after meeting the crown prince...she did not know who he was at that time! Later in the same evening, she was told who he was! There is no secret to how Mary and Frederik met, there are numerous books and articles out there...even in the unauthorized biography on Mary recently written by Emma Tom, an account was given of how Mary and Fred met...and even Emma Tom criticized the posters on these internet message boards who have taken Mary bashing to a fine art, as being "fustrated and unimaginative fiction writers". Criticism of Mary is expected, she and no-one else is perfect and neither does Mary pretend to be perfect, but at least let the criticism and judgement be constructive and based on facts...not fiction and personal opinions that have no basis in fact! As far as comparing Mary to Camilla...a woman who was an adulterer and a married man's mistress for years...considering that Camilla is now Duchess of Cornwall and future Queen, I would think that Camilla is the more manipulative and ambitious!

 

[auntie]

Auntie...who are these people you have spoken to worldwide? Persons who post on other internet message boards perhaps?

Actually, surprisingly, I do travel around and have spoken to a number of people world wide.

Mary herself said that in the first few minutes after meeting the crown prince...she did not know who he was at that time!

Yes she would say that wouldn't she? she wouldn't say, " it was rumoured that a group of European royals would be at the bar,so I thought I'd try my luck"

As far as comparing Mary to Camilla...a woman who was an adulterer and a married man's mistress for years...considering that Camilla is now Duchess of Cornwall and future Queen, I would think that Camilla is the more manipulative and ambitious!

I don't compare Camilla in anyway to CP Mary, except in the way that she and other royal ladies, who married into the job, seem more real, not trying to overdo it and more warm and natural, whilst maintaining grace and charm.
I am very neutrual regarding Camilla, but look at the GR8 job she has done!

 

[pollyemma]

Indeed, I have Auntie.

And she is not a person of insincerity.

"MII"

well of course she was sincerely happy when she met you. she was taking a taxpayer funded victory tour of her homeland. anyone would be happy under those circumstances.

 

[Linda Hsu]

Indeed, I have Auntie.

And she is not a person of insincerity.

"MII"

Margrethe II, I second that.

I also met Mary and Frederik in person at the Opera House in Syndey. I was greatly impressed by Mary's warmth, serenity and sincerity.

Mary is so nice and sincere towards people. She took time to greet everyone coming to see her at the Opera House. She is very patient, warm, natural and considerate. I really like her and Frederik very much!

Amen

 

[gattica28]

Actually, surprisingly, I do travel around and have spoken to a number of people world wide.

Yes she would say that wouldn't she? she wouldn't say, " it was rumoured that a group of European royals would be at the bar,so I thought I'd try my luck"

I don't compare Camilla in anyway to CP Mary, except in the way that she and other royal ladies, who married into the job, seem more real, not trying to overdo it and more warm and natural, whilst maintaining grace and charm.
I am very neutrual regarding Camilla, but look at the GR8 job she has done!

So you've spoken to people worldwide...were they at the Slipp Inn on the the night Fred and Mary met or do they know them personally? The girl who arranged that night was a friend of Mary's flat mate who invited her as well...refer to Emma Tom's unathorized biography or the other books about Mary out there about what happen that night! And trying to do the best job that you can in a position that you were not born into is no crime...At least she did not commit adultery and was someone's mistress to get the job! Mary is the patron of 17 organizations, has learnt one of the toughest languages on the planet, produced a son and heir and has become one of the most loved members of the DRF! Mary has done fantastic in her 17 month role as Crown Princess!

well of course she was sincerely happy when she met you. she was taking a taxpayer funded victory tour of her homeland. anyone would be happy under those circumstances.

Mary and Frederik were invited to Australia...And all offical state visitors to Australia and any other country for that matter are treated the same way...its called international diplomacy and improving relations between countries! Prince Charles also toured Australia and more tax money was spent on his visit! Like it or not, Mary is Crown Princess of Denmark and one of her roles is to visit other countries and improve the cultural and international relations between Denmark and the countries she visits!

 

[auntie]

So you've spoken to people worldwide...were they at the Slipp Inn on the the night Fred and Mary met or do they know them personally? The girl who arranged that night was a friend of Mary's flat mate who invited her as well...refer to Emma Tom's unathorized biography or the other books about Mary out there about what happen that night! And if trying to do the best job than you can into a position that you were not born into is no crime...At least she did not commit adultery and was someone's mistress to get the job!

I'm not saying people were witness to anything, but it's a general feeling, which many people I've met,from different nationalities and cultures expessed to me about (I am known for my Royalty mania), or read about on this forum and elsewhere. I'm talking about the impression she makes, noone said it about other Cprincesses, (that's why I mentioned Camilla,as she is CPrincess, although she doesn't call herself so) Read my earlier posts on this thread, she does look in love and they do look happy, but what I see mainly is that she is trying too hard to be PERFECT, Vs trying hard to do a good job and make Denmark proud of her. Ask any therapsit or even someone who has a BA in Psycology and they will tell you what that means!

 

[Margrethe II]

trying hard to do a good job and make Denmark proud of her

This is the thing...She is doing a great job and Denmark is more than proud of her...

"MII"

 

[Roxsteve]

I agree, Mary looks fake in most of her public presentations. She is trying too hard!! She should relax and be more like Maxima or Camilla. I think she really changed after marrying Fred. Just MY opinion.

 

[gattica28]

Body language...you mean the body language of a woman in love with her husband and her new baby? And exactly how is she being perfect...by learning to be fluent in Danish? By being patron of 17 organizations? By producing a male heir? And as many people that have your impression of Mary..there are just as many who are proud of how she's performed her role as Crown Princess! And I've said it before, Mary just can't win! If she was being less than who she is now in trying to do the best job she can as Crown Princess..there will be a lot of people saying she isn't fit to be Crown Princess!

 

[Little_star]

"This is the thing...She is doing a great job and Denmark is more than proud of her..."

None of my Danish family or friends are particularly proud of her and some of them have met her several times at various events and occasions.....

 

[SpiffyBallerina]

Body language...you mean the body language of a woman in love with her husband and her new baby? And exactly how is she being perfect...by learning to be fluent in Danish? By being patron of 17 organizations? By producing a male heir?

I think it's gross how people list among her accomplishments that she had a male heir. An heiress (or no child at all) would have been just fine too. It seems odd to say what a wonderful, capable, and modernizing woman she is, and then go so far back in a time-warp as to consider having a boy one of her best feats as a person.

And by the way QMII, I'm not saying CP Mary was not genuinely happy to meet you. I'm sure she was very nice and happy. I'm not saying the woman is terrible - I think she's a person who needs to put a better effort ALL the time (not just meet 'n greets and heavy press events). She's likely a nice person who is a little too caught up in herself to notice how she comes off. I'm certainly not trying to diminish your happiness at meeting her by saying that it wasn't a nice experience for you both. It must have been lovely for you and I'm glad that you got that chance. But one must also always leave room for the notion that meeting a person once isn't the best reflection of a person's character. I doubt meeting a person once in passing and just knowing a lot about them really makes one person a character authority over another.

 

[Alisa]

Annoyed princess?...spoiled brat?...aloof and distant????!!!! I have seen numerous photos, videos and interviws of Mary being very joyous, happy, laughing and thoroughly enjoying her official role as Crown Princess of Denmark! Of course, when she's happy and smiling while carrying out her duties, she's then accused of being an attention seeker! Mary just can't win...she's damned if she does and damned if she doesn't. And the definition of "brat" is that of a spoiled, ill-mannered child! A definition that does not apply to Crown Princess Mary at all...if it did, the media in Denmark, Australia and the rest of the world would have eaten her alive! It would have been all over the media!
As for Mary being a patron of Danish fashion...this is one of the most important and growing industries in Denmark that provides a lot of jobs and contributes to the Danish economy...The late Diana, Princess of Wales was famous for her interest in fashion and that contributed to British Fashion designers becoming known all over the world! The Copenhagen International Fashion Fair of which Mary is patron has grown to become one of the largest events in Europe...it is bringing more focus and media attention to Denmark! Even Crown Prince Frederik is a patron of some danish designers of furniture etc and Princess Alexandra also attended Danish fashion events as well!

Well said!

I must admit that this is the first time that I have read of her being called a "spoiled brat". I've seen many of photos and videos and i've read just about all her interviews and I have never gotten the impression that she is "spoilt", "aloof" or ever felt like she didn't want to be "bothered". I especially disagree on the latter because of the private visits she's made to her patronages and even just recently when she and Frederik contacted the DRC to ask if there was anything that they could do in regards to the earthquake in Pakistan.

I suppose where Mary and her duties are concerned the response by members on MBs varies across a spectrum. There are some at one far end that think that she loves the attention that comes with her title too much and some obviously at the other end that think that she is "annoyed" by it and can't be "bothered".

It's all perception...

 

[gattica28]

Like it or not...when the crown princesses married into their respective monarchies...one of their main roles was to have an heir or heirs! And that Mary had a male heir is a fact...If her child was a girl...it would have been the same thing! The monarchy is about continuity! With the birth of Princess Leonor, her father and grandfather have emphasized that her birth is important to the succession and the continuity of the monarchy!

 

[Margrethe II]

"This is the thing...She is doing a great job and Denmark is more than proud of her..."

None of my Danish family or friends are particularly proud of her and some of them have met her several times at various events and occasions.....

oh, ok...

Well the Danish people I speak to (quite a few in number) say that the greater majority in Denmark are proud of her and what she is accomplishing...Sorry, but the proof is in the pudding.

"MII"

 

[Little_star]

"Well the Danish people I speak to (quite a few in number) say that the greater majority in Denmark are proud of her and what she is accomplishing...Sorry, but the proof is in the pudding."

What proof? Purely subjective opinions?

 

[Margrethe II]

"Well the Danish people I speak to (quite a few in number) say that the greater majority in Denmark are proud of her and what she is accomplishing...Sorry, but the proof is in the pudding."

What proof? Purely subjective opinions?

No...fact!

"MII"

 

[gattica28]

oh, ok...

Well the Danish people I speak to (quite a few in number) say that the greater majority in Denmark are proud of her and what she is accomplishing...Sorry, but the proof is in the pudding.

"MII"

And let's face it...I don't think ALL of the people in the countries with monarchies (especially in Europe) like all of the members of their royal families either! That it totally unreasonable! Not everybody in Spain like Letizia; Not everybody in the Netherlands like Maxima; Not everybody in Great Britain like Camilla...etc..etc.

 

[Little_star]

"No...fact!"

I wasn't aware an opinion poll had been carried out to support your stance. Both your own and my stance are based purely on opinion, neither of us has any "facts", which is what makes the topic contentious to begin with.

 

[Margrethe II]

"No...fact!"

I wasn't aware an opinion poll had been carried out to support your stance. Both your own and my stance are based purely on opinion, neither of us has any "facts", which is what makes the topic contentious to begin with.

If you feel that way, why prolong it (the conversation) ?

"MII"

And let's face it...I don't think ALL of the people in the countries with monarchies (especially in Europe) like all of the members of their royal families either! That it totally unreasonable! Not everybody in Spain like Letizia; Not everybody in the Netherlands like Maxima; Not everybody in Great Britain like Camilla...etc..etc.

I did say greater majority Gattica...

"MII"

 

[Little_star]

"If you feel that way, why prolong it (the conversation) ?"

I was pointing out that your own views were not fact as you were suggesting but opinions.

 

[Margrethe II]

I was pointing out that your own views were not fact as you were suggesting but opinions.

It is a fact that the majority of Danes are very fond and proud of Mary..this not opinion, but fact!

And, being able to draw from a personal ecounter I think holds a credible account and look at the person in question.

"MII"

 

[SpiffyBallerina]

Hey, I know someone who met Ted Bundy and thought he was a nice guy. Really, meeting a person once doesn't mean you know anything about their character or personality; and it certainly doesn't make you an authority who can wave the meeting of said person over every else's head to say that you know the truth and treat everyone else like uninformed idiots.

 

[Margrethe II]

Hey, I know someone who met Ted Bundy and thought he was a nice guy. Really, meeting a person once doesn't mean you know anything about their character or personality; and it certainly doesn't make you an authority who can wave the meeting of said person over every else's head to say that you know the truth and treat everyone else like uninformed idiots.

Uninformed?...desperately misguided is what sums it up.

"MII"

 

[fromEU]

Let's bear in mind that Mary has been in the public eye going on 5 years now...Her life has been completely exposed by the media...Emma Tom just wrote an unauthorized biography on her and could not find any hidden dirty secrets on Mary! Reading a lot of the internet message boards on royalty, there are a lot of people who do not like Mary (which is entirely their right)! However, if any of these people had any "information" on Mary...they could have sold it to the media by now! In addition, the DRF would have had Mary's past checked out, so they know everything there is to know about her! So anyone claiming to have such exclusive information (truthful and untruthful)..do not know anything that we have not heard about Mary already...even Emma Tom in her book criticized the nasty comments written about Mary on the internet as the work of "fustrated and unimaginative fiction writers".
In the final analysis...anyone who cares to take the time to find out the truth and the facts would know that Mary does a lot of other work besides being the patron for the Danish Fashion industry (as can be seen from the numerous threads of her activities on this message board)...in addition, she has a loving husband, has produced a son and direct heir to the Danish throne, learnt one of the most difficult languages in the world to the point of being fluent, has the support of a royal family that allows her to thrive and grow in her role as Crown Princess and has the support of the Danish people! And no matter who claims to have this so-called "information" on Her Royal Highness The Crown Princess Mary Elizabeth of Denmark...nothing can change the fact that she is presently the wife of the Crown Prince of Denmark, the mother of the future King of Denmark and a respected senior member of the Danish Royal Family!

I agree with you very much, but do not try to be too extreem. Mary is very popular to many people in Denmark, but she is also only liked by many people Denmark, she is possible indeffierent to some people also and she is probably also dislikede by other people. Try not to genearalize 100%. There is varied but possible not much difference with other crown princersses.

I don't think there is much more difference for the other crown princesses on the other countries. The only difference is for the fans on this and other boards. Not for the people in the different countriess.They don't care about the other Crownprincesses in the other cother countries. Only about thiwer own Crown princess. That is where the problem is. Some fans tries to make a bad name of the princess who(on this board only) steal the shine of thier favorite princesses.

 

[Margrethe II]

Some fans tries to make a bad name of the princess who(on this board only) steal the shine of thier favorite princesses.

How very true FromEU!

"MII"