What does King Constantine do?

[Gutsy]

The Greek Royal Family always seemed to have been much poorer and less well-housed than the other dynasties. It was part of the gwoing criticism of the 1960's that the late Queen Mother and the young King were too lavish in their style and expenditures. Given the lively irreverence and quarrelsome nature of the Greeks its a wonder the monarchy lasted as long as it did.

 

[ChevalieurduCiel]

Quarrelsome nature of Greeks....mmmmmm!Irreverence??About the first i totaly agree,about the second I don't.I think that irreverence is cultivated into Greeks...

 

[Wallis]

Quarrelsome nature of Greeks....mmmmmm!Irreverence??About the first i totaly agree,about the second I don't.I think that irreverence is cultivated into Greeks...

The Greeks are the founders and inventors of democracy. I'm not surprised that they never really warmed up to the idea of a monarchy. Perhaps instead of the word "quarrelsome," the Greeks should be described more as "headstrong"?

 

[Wallis]

I'm sorry ChevalieurduCiel, but I did not mean to put that smiley face on your quote. I guess I'm technically handicapped.

 

[Diogenes]

The Greek Royal Family always seemed to have been much poorer and less well-housed than the other dynasties. It was part of the gwoing criticism of the 1960's that the late Queen Mother and the young King were too lavish in their style and expenditures. Given the lively irreverence and quarrelsome nature of the Greeks its a wonder the monarchy lasted as long as it did.

That wasn't the straw that broke the camel's back.. The Greeks grew gradually disgruntled because of the queen mother's interference in politics (quite unlike QEII).
You are right, Greeks and unelected despots just don't go well together

 

[Piaa]

Isn't it true that a politician actually slapped Queen Frederica in the face (or was it the other way around?)

 

[Daytona]

Isn't it true that a politician actually slapped Queen Frederica in the face (or was it the other way around?)

If i remember correctly it was Konstantinos Karamanlis prime minister at that time that slapped Frederica.Karamanlis did not have the best relations with the queen because she was interffering a lot with politics,she was asking constantly money etc.

 

[iannis]

Isn't it true that a politician actually slapped Queen Frederica in the face (or was it the other way around?)

It was not a politician, but a common woman, during an unofficial visit of Frederika in London. This woman attempted to 'protest' this way because of her left-wing brother being kept in the prison for reasons not having to do with politics though. If I am not mistaken, she didn't manage to actually slap her.

 

[Little_star]

Is there any truth in the rumours that the Greek Royal Family are basically bank-rolled by Marie-Chantal's family? I've heard this suggestion in the past and wondered if there was any basis to it.

 

[branchg]

Constantine is not "bankrolled" by the Millers, but he did receive a dowry from Robert Miller when Marie-Chantal married Pavlos. The number I've heard was $30 million, but who knows.

Marie-Chantal has a trust fund worth hundreds of millions that she shares with her two sisters, so there are certainly no money worries for her or Pavlos.

 

[BeatrixFan]

It was not a politician, but a common woman, during an unofficial visit of Frederika in London. This woman attempted to 'protest' this way because of her left-wing brother being kept in the prison for reasons not having to do with politics though. If I am not mistaken, she didn't manage to actually slap her.

It was outside the Dorchester but the woman didn't manage to slap Frederika. She was hauled off by police and Frederika refused to leave London until she got an apology which the woman did give. Churchill was furious and gave Frederika a horse from The Royal Mews to make up for the incident.

 

[ChevalieurduCiel]

The Greeks are the founders and inventors of democracy. I'm not surprised that they never really warmed up to the idea of a monarchy. Perhaps instead of the word "quarrelsome," the Greeks should be described more as "headstrong"?

You mean Kafroi or copani????

 

[ChevalieurduCiel]

I'm sorry ChevalieurduCiel, but I did not mean to put that smiley face on your quote. I guess I'm technically handicapped.

I don't mind !Feel free to do anything,perhaps the handicapped in this forum is only me!!

 

[kelly9480]

Constantine is not "bankrolled" by the Millers, but he did receive a dowry from Robert Miller when Marie-Chantal married Pavlos. The number I've heard was $30 million, but who knows.

Marie-Chantal has a trust fund worth hundreds of millions that she shares with her two sisters, so there are certainly no money worries for her or Pavlos.

Constantine still lives off the handouts from the rich Greeks so there's no way he got the dowry. Miller wouldn't have willingly paid it, and the Greeks wouldn't continue to support him if he had his own money. Each of the sisters has their own trust fund -- I think around 200million, though whether that's dollars or pounds, I haven't heard -- they don't share one.

 

[Diogenes]

If i remember correctly it was Konstantinos Karamanlis prime minister at that time that slapped Frederica.Karamanlis did not have the best relations with the queen because she was interffering a lot with politics,she was asking constantly money etc.

You are probably quite right, although another apocryphal version makes Konstantine the recipient of the then prime minister's wrath.

Karamanlis was very much a ladies man and a lot was said at the time about his love/hate relationship with Frederica. At the same time he was pretty much a 'man's man' who didn't take any nonsense. Needless to say, eleven years of self-exile in Paris finally made a gentleman out of him!

 

[iannis]

You mean Kafroi or copani????

I am of the opinion that κάφροι suits them best!

 

[Stefanie]

Return service

If there are still rich Greeks who support Konstantin they may expect a return service. What kind of return service is Konstantin able to give?And who belongs to such rich Greek persons?Was Konstantin good friend with Onassis?

 

[kelly9480]

According to someone who knows them, they still consider him to be their king, and they see him as a friend who needs financial assistance they can easily afford to provide. I'm not sure whether Constantine was friends with Onassis, I know he was friends with Latsis, even though Latsis also gave money to the Greek government that deposed him. Onassis or one of the other shippers gave Friederike that massive sapphire she was seen wearing in some 1950s-1960s photos.

 

[iannis]

When Princess Sofia was about to get married to Juan Carlos in 1962 and there was a great dispute between the government and the people with regard to the overwhelming dowry of 9,000,000 drachmas the palace wanted to give to her, Onassis also offered to pay it himself, so Greeks would stop arguing.

 

[ChevalieurduCiel]

Our King's Name's day

.......Happy Name's Day Your Majesty

 

[Diogenes]

I'm not sure whether Constantine was friends with Onassis, I know he was friends with Latsis, even though Latsis also gave money to the Greek government that deposed him. Onassis or one of the other shippers gave Friederike that massive sapphire she was seen wearing in some 1950s-1960s photos.

Onassis was always a bit of an outsider, accepted by the international jet-set but not seen as a fully paid-up member of the neo-aristocracy of the Latsis or Niarchos variety. I would be very surprised if the greek royals had a lot of time for him

 

[kimebear]

Greek royal family godparents

I had thought that the Greek RF would be members of the Greek Orthodox Church. Are they actually members of the Church of England? I saw recent pictures of Constantine and Anne Marie attending church with Charles and Camilla. I also know that William is godfather to Pavlos and MC's oldest son and that Queen Elizabeth is godmother to Theodora. Any info would be appreciated!

 

[acdc1]

Prince Charles is godfather to Maria Olympia, Pavlos and M-C's eldest child.

 

[ilias of john]

His Majesty King Konstantine is Godfather to HRH Prince William.
Long Live Our King!

 

[lucien]

I had thought that the Greek RF would be members of the Greek Orthodox Church. Are they actually members of the Church of England? I saw recent pictures of Constantine and Anne Marie attending church with Charles and Camilla. I also know that William is godfather to Pavlos and MC's oldest son and that Queen Elizabeth is godmother to Theodora. Any info would be appreciated!

The Greek RF ARE members of the Greek Orthodox Church,and certainly not members of the Church of England,but that doesn't prevent them to attend services of memorials/weddings etc. by other denominations when invited,like everyone else.

 

[Philippe Egalite']

I read something a while ago that had me thinking.
In it they talked about the greek royal family and some kind of official engagement. or reception, I don't remember very well.
Constantine and his wife never renounce their titles so technically they are still King and Queen but also ex-King and ex-Queen, and his son might still be the crown prince untill the day he dies. After that, is going to be like the other former ruling houses.
My question is, why are they still doing that?, I personally find it ridiculous specially when they are not representing anything.
Also why is pavlos' wife taking part in that and using the title princess.
Every time she is in the NY she demands to be treated as HRH and as princess.
I ask this beacuse to be doing and to be demanding these kinds of things they need somethig to back it up with, and in greece this things are not permitted anymore.

I can understand your surprise but be reminded that there are tons of people who live and prosper by exploiting the ignorance and naivete' of others who, in turn, may be the willing victims of their own self-aggrandizement or greed. For example, designer X throws a PR party and the invitation quotes that "HRH crown princess Y of Transylvania will attend". To many, this means automatically that the event will be an important social gathering.

I cannot believe that the wife of former King Constantine's first son is so naive as to demand that she be treated as crown princess. I bet though that she expects it from the type of people she associates with and I would also bet that they also love to be in the company of a crown princess. Thus, they are deluding themselves but as long as they are happy, why not. They don't violate any law and there is no deception here.

You are entitled to style yourself as HRH prince Ben of Hullabaloo. The issue is how many people are out there willing to treat you as such. And if they are willing to do so AND while they know that your title is fictitious, why not??

Back to reality now:
King Constantine, former King of the Hellenes, was born a (real) prince and became a (real) king. Likewise, Queen Anne-Marie was born a (real) princess and became a (real) queen. At this juncture, their royal status has no legal or constitutional backing, however, by courtesy only and convention, in civil society, individuals are referred to and addressed by their former title. eg senator A, ambassador B, president C, secretary D etc etc. Moreover, with respect to royalty, their title stems from birthright and, as such, it cannot be lost. Thus, Constantine shall remain king for life BUT he is NO more the King of the Hellenes or Greece (former king of the Hellenes is both correct and appropriate). Likewise, Anne-Marie shall remain queen for life BUT she is NO more the queen of the Hellenes or Greece (former queen of the Hellenes is both correct and appropriate).
This is also true for their first three children, Alexia, Pavlos and Nikolaos. She was born a princess (in fact, not only a princess of Greece but crown princess until the birth of prince Pavlos) and they were born princes (in fact, Pavlos as crown prince). Thus, all three of them shall remain princess and princes, respectively, for life. However, because they got married after Greece became a republic, their spouses, unless they hold titles in their own rights, hold NO title by marriage. Now, the way they or their spouses expect to be addressed and the way their relations address them is a matter for their own consumption, their prerrogative and of no concern to me or anyone else. That's democracy guys.

Now, the last two children of King Constantine and Queen Anne-Marie, Theodora and Philippos were NOT born a princess and prince, respectively. Thus, they may be referred to as princess and prince, respectively, ONLY by courtesy.

 

[lyndaW]

Thanks that was very well explained. So Theodora & Philippos were not born P or P. interesting family

 

[ilias of john]

Philippe Egalite'
You make several interesting points and We are all impressed with your fluid and precise arguments. < ed personal comment : Warren > The two youngest children of T.M are both Prince and Princess as are the grandchildren.Why? Because they are "of the blood" and because The King made them so.
Secondly,illegal acts whether or not they have been inshrined in Greece's constituition have no moral standing whatsoever and hence H.M The King is the true Greek Head of State irrespective of the illegal and immoral referendum and constituition.

< ed: Warren >

 

[Philippe Egalite']

I protest strenuoulsy your comments about the Greek Constitution < ed: Warren >. Hellas (Greece) is a sovereign republic and a democracy where the will of the majority of its people reigns supreme.

It has been argued by many, including myself in another post, that the referendum of 1974 was conducted under unequal circumstances. This remains a fact but, obviously, the wrongdoing cannot be reversed.

Nonetheless, were a referendum to be conducted today, the monarchy would have hardly received 10-12% of the popular vote. This is being acknowledged by royalists and non-royalists, internal and external sources. Indeed, this is the very reason that prince Pavlos proceeded with an unequal marriage and, in fact, one that would have infuriated the Greek populus.

Needless to say that King Constantine or any member of his family is most welcome to live permanently in Greece and, why not, run for public office.

And let me also add that even if the old constitution, that of royal democracy, was in effect, IT did not recognize titles of princes and princesses BUT only those of the Diadoch, that is heir to the throne and of Vassilopaides ie, royal children (Greek Vassilopais = royal child) in a manner identical to that of Spain where there are infantes and infantas BUT only the Heir(ess) is a prince(ss). Although the infantas are constantly addressed as princesses outside Spain, the country's constitution does NOT provide for this title.
Because the terms infante/infanta (Spanish) kai Vassilopais (Greek) had (have) no equivalent elsewhere in royal parlance, these individuals are, by convention, addressed as princes/princesses BUT strictly speaking they are not.

< ed: Warren >

 

[ilias of john]

Phillip,
1.You commented about the illegality of the '74 referundum and mentioned that wrongdoings cannot be undone.A true system of justice could,would and should!

2.You comment , that a referendum would only give the King 10-12% of the votes and that this has been aknoweledged by pro and anti monarchists alike.How do they know,what sort of regular polls have been conducted and what sort of positive and negative influences are at play?

3.HRH Prince Pavlos of Greece did not marry his wife for those reasons I'm sure.Please let me know if he has told you otherwise.

4.You mention that H.M The King is welcome to live in Greece and even run for political office. How can he live in Greece as a Greek when your like deny him citizenship on the false pretence that he will not declare a surname? You have mentioned that their surname is Gluxburg or Beck.Show us any document (use a scanner) of the last 250 years,ever since the family became Dukes of Gluxburg(i think it is at least 500 years by the way) that calls them ie. Spiros Gluxburg rarther than Spiros of Gluxburg.

5.You make the point of the titles of Prince,Princess,Diadochos and Vasilopaidi and use the lame excuse of constituitions < ed political comment: Warren > conventions and Spain and her Royal Family.To answer you in reverse order I know nothing about the Spanish nor do i care,sorry Spanish friends ).In terms of conventions the U.K does not even have a constituition their entire political system is based on conventions and their Royal sons/daughters are called Prince/Princess.

< ed: Warren >