Should Camilla attend the memorial service for Diana?

[BeatrixFan]

It does not matter what both Princes say or do.

Then let's boot them out of Highgrove and have a republic. If everything they say is going to be ignored and is worthless, whats the point in having them at all, especially when one is due to be King?

 

[ysbel]

I do think the Windsors are in effect telling the world, This is all our family, this is who we are, we are not going to leave one of our own at home conveniently to suit anyone else's pleasure and the rest of the world can take us or leave us.

It is a risky move; but gutsy. Only time will tell if they succeed but I, for one, admire them for it.

 

[sirhon11234]

Well its official Camilla is attending I hope she wears something elegant and walks with her head high. This memorial has turned into a cirus thanks to the media and some over obbesessed Diana fanatics.

 

[Al_bina]

To BeatrixFan

Dear BeatrixFan,
It has been most kind of you to share your views on my post.
Whatever Princes do or say in regards to accepting their stepmother and not blaming her will not defuse the inherent controversy associated with Duchess of Cornwall. As laid down in Wikipedia (n.d.), Prince William will be “holding a largely ceremonial position of the head of the state”.
As for establishing a new republic, it is up to the subjects of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland to decide.

 

[BeatrixFan]

You miss my point, you said that their views would be ignored whatever they said. Well, if that's the case then surely this affects more than just a guest list?

 

[Elspeth]

Not necessarily. I think this particular topic is one where people who feel strongly enough won't listen to anyone, especially the princes who they claim to support. If you're dealing with people who refuse to be rational, it's their problem, not the princes' problem.

 

[Al_bina]

I believe that Princes should never derogate in expressing their anger or any other feelings to “people who refuse to be rational” (Elspeth, 2007).

 

[Skydragon]

From the Mail article, posted by CDE - Camilla defends her front row seat at Diana service | the Daily Mail

The document demonstrates that Camilla was concerned about public hostility as far back as January, when details of the service were announced - "Normally the letters you receive from the palace are nothing more than polite acknowledgements of your correspondence," she said". This shows quite clearly, therefore, how rattled Camilla and Clarence House were by the public response to the announcement that she would attend."

Does it, in what way, she was replying nicely to what was probably a vitriolic letter from a Diana nutter of the first order. What clearly escaped this woman(?) was that Camilla was being polite, probably an alien concept to the DC.

"He (William) has spoken at length about Camilla and says he doesn't believe she broke his parents' marriage up. He says it was solely down to them and the Press.
"He is angry at the way this issue has been allowed to overshadow the service that he and Harry have spent so long organising.

And quite right to, that he is angry at the thoughtless few!

 

[ysbel]

I believe that Princes should never derogate in expressing their anger or any other feelings to “people who refuse to be rational” (Elspeth, 2007).

I'm not quite sure if all members know the meaning of the word derogate, Al_bina. It means to belittle someone or insult disparagingly. I disagree with your use of derogate; I don't think that the Princes are insulting or belittling the Diana circle by exclaiming anger at their actions. They are simply expressing anger that in the name of Diana, the Diana circle has taken to attack another one of their family members. It is quite natural to feel and express anger towards an outsider if a member of one's family is attacked. If the Princes' anger is excessive then yes I would think it is damaging to their reputation but their anger doesn't seem excessive.

I think the custom of family loyalty is common to all countries and cultures.

 

[Duchess]

I'm not quite sure if all members know the meaning of the word derogate, Al_bina. It means to belittle someone or insult disparagingly. I disagree with your use of derogate; I don't think that the Princes are insulting or belittling the Diana circle by exclaiming anger at their actions. They are simply expressing anger that in the name of Diana, the Diana circle has taken to attack another one of their family members. It is quite natural to feel and express anger towards an outsider if a member of one's family is attacked. If the Princes' anger is excessive then yes I would think it is damaging to their reputation but their anger doesn't seem excessive.

I think the custom of family loyalty is common to all countries and cultures.

i couldn't agree more. when an outsider attacks a member of one's family it's natural (in most cases) for the family to close ranks and protect the one being attacked. the boys clearly love and respect the duchess and feel protective of her. if they let this criticism go by without responding then i think we could accurately assume that they felt otherwise but that's not the case. i think we all agree that the boys are diana's greatest legacy and are the only ones that can/should speak for her now. having said that, when they show their acceptance of their father's wife into their lives why can't the public do the same?? is it the place of those who attack the duchess to do so? i don't think it is. think about your own lives...if they were played out in the media would you care what the public thought?

 

[BeatrixFan]

The Duchess shouldn't have to stoop to explain herself to the Diana Circle of all people. She's a Princess of the Realm for goodness sake. We didn't build an Empire by kow-towing to plebians like Mrs Funnell.

 

[Al_bina]

ysbel,
It has been most kind of you to educate me on the meaning of the phrasal verb “derogate”. However, “to derogate in doing smth” implies “to demean oneself by doing smth”.
Presence of Duchess of Cornwall has been doomed to stir up controversies from the onset. The Princess Diana loyalists regard a mere presence of THAT WOMAN as the ultimate disrespect because the Princess put the blame for the failed marriage upon THAT WOMAN. At the same time, Prince William and Prince Harry have already sent a clear message to the public on multiple occasions that they have accepted their stepmother.
Under the inherently controversial circumstances, I believe that both Princes should refrain from showing any emotional responses or putting forth their eloquence to explain reasons/causes. Aristocrats are expected to show their emotions as less as possible (my grandmother used to say it to me). Such actions should serve as indication to those people, who do not wish to understand and /or accept facts, that this topic is closed for discussions.
As for Duchess of Cornwall’s explanation letter, she has brewed the situation for herself and let her explain and justify her actions to the public. It is rather entertaining to see.
Summing the said up, it is nice to know that the male part of the population is blessed with such forgiving nature ….

 

[Jo of Palatine]

Elspeth,
It has been most kind of you to educate me on the meaning of the phrasal verb “derogate”. However, “to derogate in doing smth” implies “to demean oneself by doing smth”.
Presence of Duchess of Cornwall has been doomed to stir up controversies from the onset. The Princess Diana loyalists regard a mere presence of THAT WOMAN as the ultimate disrespect because the Princess put the blame for the failed marriage upon THAT WOMAN.

It really is demeaning to have to read how somebody who claims to be educated can steep as low as calling a Royal Highness personally unknown to her "THAT WOMAN only because of somebody else as personally unknown to her as HRH is said so. I wish we would not be subjected to such a display of a love of hearsay in connection with at least questionable manners.

 

[Jo of Palatine]

The Duchess shouldn't have to stoop to explain herself to the Diana Circle of all people. She's a Princess of the Realm for goodness sake. We didn't build an Empire by kow-towing to plebians like Mrs Funnell.

But I really like the way HRH tries to calm the waters on knowing that she will always be a controversial person when it comes to her stepsons - she is willing to do it in order to save her stepsons pain - I like that! But you are right, of course.

 

[Al_bina]

to Joe of Palatine

It really is demeaning to have to read how somebody who claims to be educated can steep as low as calling a Royal Highness personally unknown to her "THAT WOMAN only because of somebody else as personally unknown to her as HRH is said so. I wish we would not be subjected to such a display of a love of hearsay in connection with at least questionable manners.

Dear Jo of Palatine,
I have got a few acid comments of my posts, but I have never accused any Forum member of being ill-bred. So I do not feel that I should be subjected to such comments from you. You do not know me personally to question my manners. I am sorry for not getting the positive and shiny aura that Duchess of Cornwall spreads around her. I have just expressed my opinion with the WORDS that would better reflect my thoughts.
Although I feel offended, I am educated enough to understand that you simply do not care about my feellings much.

 

[pinkie40]

My thoughts on the Duchess attending the service. First, it is imperative that the Duchess be seen supporting Prince William and Harry whatever they may do. Secondly, she is the wife of their father and no matter what feelings from the past may surface, she is invited as a matter of politeness. The focus is not on Camilla for the hour but on the healing and comforting of the still mourning and a celebration of the life of the late princess.

Now...the Windsors have an uncanny way of showing "kindness" when buckets of bitterness remain as the exemptions of certain other former royal spouses and friends and employees of the late Princess can attest. I have more of an issue of the exclusions of invitees rather than the inclusions like Camilla......

Above, all let us all remember this is a service in a holy and consecrated place. Miracles happen when holy words are spoken and received. Perhaps Camilla will be so moved by the service she will incorporate some of the best traits of the late Princess into her own persona...or the words will fall like heaps of buring coal upon her consciousness....

 

[Skydragon]

Perhaps Camilla will be so moved by the service she will incorporate some of the best traits of the late Princess into her own persona..

To many, myself included, Camilla already possessed and possesses all the best traits needed to be the wife of the future King.

 

[pinkie40]

Why of course she does.....but I give that thought voice to those who still fail to focus on the living and errantly compare the past to the present.

My wish for Camilla is that she is seen for who she is and what she wants to become without petty comparisons. Prince Charles will be reflected historically by both women who were his wives. My view is that we remember the past by respecting the present with healing words in a place of holiness.

 

[ysbel]

Elspeth,
It has been most kind of you to educate me on the meaning of the phrasal verb “derogate”. However, “to derogate in doing smth” implies “to demean oneself by doing smth”..

Al_bina, I (ysbel) gave the definition of derogate; not Elspeth and I gave the definition not to disparage your education but because the majority of members here at The Royal Forums aren't familiar with the term derogate. The more common term we use in English is denigrate and both terms mean approximately the same thing. In English, however, the reflexive pronoun is required for both verbs to have the meaning you intended and you didn't use the reflexive pronoun which caused some confusion among our members as to what you meant.

This mistake is understandable, English is not your first language; no one is making fun of you here but that's why I misunderstood you.

Thanks for clariyfing your meaning, however, I'm afraid I still disagree. If Camilla attends a family event which some elements of the public criticize her for, I think she supports her family and the act does not at all demean her or the family who defends her against the criticism.

Aristocrats are expected to show their emotions as less as possible (my grandmother used to say it to me). …

If you think aristocrats should show no emotion then I wonder what is your opinion of Diana who displayed a lot of emotion both in public and in private.

I think William and Harry showed relatively less emotion than their mother in their last display of anger.

 

[ysbel]

I understand what you mean pinkie. Thanks for sharing and welcome to The Royal Forums!

 

[Al_bina]

To yesbel

I do apologise for the mistake in the name. Additional thanks for explanations.
I have already stated that I liked Princess Diana's style to certain extent. At the same, I refrain from judging her or anybody's deaminor. As you know "Judge not, less ye be judged and found unworthy". If I dare say so, but the Princess lacked sophistication in revenge. Hopefully no one is offended by the above statement.
As for Prince William's reaction, it is my personal impression. I might be wrong.
Finally, the presence of Duchess of Cornwall as well as other individuals that have been invited to attend the service does not matter me. It is up to the British Royal family and their inner circle. Let them be emotional and do whatever they want. Considering that I have been "found unworthy", I do not wish to be subjected to any other “clever” comments from the members of this thread.

 

[pinkie40]

I do apologise for the mistake in the name. Additional thanks for explanations.
I have already stated that I liked Princess Diana's style to certain extent. At the same, I refrain from judging her or anybody's deaminor. As you know "Judge not, less ye be judged and found unworthy". If I dare say so, but the Princess lacked sophistication in revenge. Hopefully no one is offended by the above statement.
As for Prince William's reaction, it is my personal impression. I might be wrong.
Finally, the presence of Duchess of Cornwall as well as other individuals that have been invited to attend the service does not matter me. It is up to the British Royal family and their inner circle. Let them be emotional and do whatever they want. Considering that I have been "found unworthy", I do not wish to be subjected to any other “clever” comments from the members of this thread.

The way Al Bina has been made to feel is probably the way Camilla feels when she is told of how some people consider her presence at this ceremony.

The way I was raised was that forgiveness and kindness and focusing on what is important to those who still grieve the loss of a mother overrode any harsh emotion I felt towards a controversial attendee to such an event.

We are talking about excluding their stepmother whom I am sure feels uncomfortable every time she steps out the door from the majority of those of us who adore Diana. If we want to support William and Harry, we will be forgiving and gracious to their father and stepmother for this one hour IN A HOUSE OF WORSHIP they focus in remembering their mother.

 

[ysbel]

Hi pinkie, the mere fact that others disagree in the threads shouldn't make people feel uncomfortable. It may fall out in a thread where you are the only one that has your opinion (and that happens to me a lot sometimes) but as long as people are respectful, then there is no reason to feel unwelcome.

But we are an international board and misunderstandings can occur due to language and cultural differences.

The one thing that I noticed in this past conversation is that ALL CAPS is often interpreted as shouting and angry and sometimes gets an angry response although the original statement may not have been intended as angry at all.

When in doubt, I think a hefty dose of politeness and tolerance goes a long way here and on any other board.

 

[pinkie40]

Hi pinkie, the mere fact that others disagree in the threads shouldn't make people feel uncomfortable. It may fall out in a thread where you are the only one that has your opinion (and that happens to me a lot sometimes) but as long as people are respectful, then there is no reason to feel unwelcome.

But we are an international board and misunderstandings can occur due to language and cultural differences.

The one thing that I noticed in this past conversation is that ALL CAPS is often interpreted as shouting and angry and sometimes gets an angry response although the original statement may not have been intended as angry at all.

When in doubt, I think a hefty dose of politeness and tolerance goes a long way here and on any other board.

Yes I totally agree and apologize for the caps...yet I think sometimes we loose sight of this being a religious service in a place of worship (not a youth oriented concert venue) in which there will be a focus on those feelings and memories of William and Harry, primarily. Perhaps for the time when I enter the portals of a chapel, I am more humble and more accepting of those under that same roof more so than I would be if I were to meet them on the pavement...although I hope I am the same in kindness wherever I go. I hope this same politeness can be extended to Camilla by those of us who admire Diana.

I also felt that Al Bina personified the ostracism Camilla might feel when "judged". I do believe in Al Bina's quote of "Judge or be judged". I, too have made dour judgements against Camilla in the past, but the time and hour of forgiveness is quickly at hand.

Sometimes I think we fail to realize the real and breathing person focused on, Camilla, Duchess of Cornwall, must feel awfully uncomfortble in this summer of remembrance, this week the nadir of that experience. I might not ever be able to find the time to have a cup of tea with her if I were ever asked (ahem) but I do believe we should find a modicum of courtesy for her if she wants to be seen supporting William and Harry in a sad hour of their lives.

 

[sirhon11234]

I hope this same politeness can be extended to Camilla by those of us who admire Diana.

That goes vice versa I also try not to judge Camilla to harshely and acknowledge some of her duties which she's doing a good job.
Its sad that some fans and the media has turned this memorial into a circus.

 

[ysbel]

No need to apologize pinkie. You may laugh but I wasn't thinking of your ALL CAPS at all when I wrote that!

I think its easy to forget that all these people are human. Camilla, Charles, Diana, William, Harry, they're doing what they think is best at the time although they may think differently later.

I think anyone who takes a solitary or unpopular stand will feel alone sometimes. I don't condone adultery but I do wish I had Camilla's ability to focus on the people around her whether it be Charles, the boys, or her own children and endeavouring to make sure the relationships with those people are good before she worries about how it will play with the rest of the world.

 

[Empress]

Well, having just worked up the courage to sort through this thread... good grief is it long, I have to say, I really think that it is bad form for Camilla to attend this service. Even if her step children, ie the princes, want her to, I think that it can do her public profile no good. Whatever the reasons for Charles and Diana's breakup she did have a role in it. I am not saying that any party was an angel, because none were, but I think that in this case, she should just keep a low profile.

It will be too much for some people, who will undoubtedly say that she is spitting on Diana's memory. Not to say that she is, but were I her, I would not go.

Her going is just not kosher in my opinion. Diana held a lot of animosity towards her, for whatever reason, and did not consider her a friend. IN ANY situation, I think that the people who honor your memory at such a service should be those who cared for you in life, and for whom you cared as well.

Just my opinion though.

 

[jcbcode99]

I have been away and have finally found the time to sort through this thread--it did take some time. The discussion is wonderfully witty, charming, somewhat explosive and enjoyable. I'm pleased we are all able to offer our opinions on the subject.
Yes, Diana did hold "animosity" towards the Duchess. I think any of us would feel that way if we were in that situation--but there is a key difference that some have ignored--we aren't royal and our lives don't play out on message boards and newspapers. This battle has been raging for far too long and I do believe that William and Harry are trying to move beyond the past in some ways with this memorial. They are honoring their mother for the woman she was--and for the mother they lost. It is a sad time for them and people are turning it into a profit making, argument inducing spectacle. Perhaps WIlliam and Harry, by inviting Camilla, are trying to make clear to the world that the past is the past, leave it there. The boys have, they love and respect their step-mother. Even William has been quoted as saying that he didn't blame Camilla for the breakdown in the marriage. And he is right. Ultimately, the Prince and Princess of Wales were too different. He was pushed into a marriage with her because she was suitable and she had been in love with the idea of him since she was quite young. They grew apart not because of Camilla but because of their extreme differences. They did make a good team once, though. But, it wasn't enough. Their children see and acknowledge that--why is it so hard for the rest of the world? Let them remember the mother they lost ten years ago without dragging all of this into it.

 

[PR Princess]

Well since we are in this topic, there was an article about Camilla attending the Memorial of Diana, Princess of Wales. Some people felt that Camilla does not deserve to attend, but I believe it is up to the sons of Diana. It was said that Prince William and Henry, since December they invited the Duchess of Cornwall to the Memorial.

The article:
The Royalist - Rosa Monckton: Camilla Shouldn't Attend Diana Memorial

 

[Incas]

It wouldn't surprise me if a lot of the people at the service would rather have spent the day in private remembrance. IMO, the public pressure to have a big do on the anniversary is bordering on the macabre. All the articles about whether the Duchess should and shouldn't have. All of this would have went away if the principles, the princes and whomever they chose to spend the day with, were allowed to have a private service. Instead, the public expects a bigger gesture, much as the public demands on the royals in the week before the funeral ten years ago. There is a ghoulish desire to see gushing tears from the princes. If either William or Harry throws a punch at the Duchess, in full view of the cameras of course, so much the better for ratings on their "news" specials.