Press Reports about Carl Philip and Sofia Hellqvist, Part 2: April 2012 - June 2014

[Dman]

Perhaps and the fact that the cameras are on her. It's obvious she likes fame, I don't know why everyone else tries to avoid the obvious.

I see a great deal of the royals looking at the camera and in some cases the camera loves them right back.

I remember some complaining about the Duchess of Cambridge loving the camera before her engagement to William. I would rather them give the camera a nice loving smile for the camera than to look angry and irritated in the camera.

If I was dating a princess and I saw the camera, l'll make sure to give them a nice friendly smile. I'll try to look my best to look good and handsome as possible in those pictures that will be published across the Internet, magazines and newspapers.

 

[NGalitzine]

Maybe people are fed up with princesses with scandalous pasts; Maxima's past isn't her past in the sense that she is the one who has to overcome something that she did. It wasn't her, it was her father. As for the rest of them, in varying degrees they have had to have expensive PR campaigns and it's disconcerting how the public is not just supposed to forgive and forget, but LURVE the princesses as well. Just because the prince loves them. It's not about the public, but about the prince.

Mostly I would say that in their own countries the people generally have been happy that their princes have found a woman they love and want to marry them and have accepted them as members of their national royal families. How these new princes and princesses have been received in the US may be a matter you are better able to speak to.

What about the taxpayers of Sweden?

Do they count or do they exist to just pay up and shut up? CP and Sofia will after all be representing them in an official capacity.

I did mention the Government of Sweden and in constitutional monarchies the government speaks for the people, the tabloids do not.

Aren't repentant sinners worthy of being forgiven? If they get married, and they aren't happy, or if her behavior is shocking the tolerant Swedes, then they can get divorced.

I can only imagine how scandalized some posters would have been had the internet existed in an earlier era at the knowledge that Prince Bertil of Sweden was living with a divorced former model from Wales and later married her and made her HRH Princess of Sweden and royal duchess. Gasp!! There would have been much clutching of pearls and reaching for smelling salts at the realization that time and society was moving on.

 

[Roslyn]

Millions of women make the choices to purse their education or work in the work-a-day world rather than take their clothes off for money and fame.

What percentage of those women are as physically beautiful and photogenic as Sofia and likely to have have been offered the opportunity? If I had been and someone had offered me lots of money to take my clothes off to the extent she's been photographed with her clothes off, you can bet I'd have done it.

It's obvious she likes fame, I don't know why everyone else tries to avoid the obvious.

In my opinion, all that the smiling photos make obvious is that she is a woman who doesn't mind being photographed and chooses to smile at the cameras when she is being photographed. The same could be said about Princess Beatrice of York.

 

[dbarn67]

What percentage of those women are as physically beautiful and photogenic as Sofia and likely to have have been offered the opportunity? If I had been and someone had offered me lots of money to take my clothes off to the extent she's been photographed with her clothes off, you can bet I'd have done it.



In my opinion, all that the smiling photos make obvious is that she is a woman who doesn't mind being photographed and chooses to smile at the cameras when she is being photographed. The same could be said about Princess Beatrice of York.

A good percentage I would guess. There a lot a women walking around my city many more beautiful than Sofia. I have no way of knowing if they've all been offered the opportunity to pose nude but I'd guess many would not. Because many women have raised to value themselves for more than what is on the outside. I have a friend who is STUNNING and has been offered the opportunity to be a a real model not a nude and she said no. She became one the top students in her law school and went on to become a successful lawyer. I have more stories of women who are commercially gorgeous but have chosen to become successful by the merit of the brains over thei assets of their bodies.

For what it's worth I think CP will marry Sofia, and again, I wish the SRF the best.


I have no comment on your willingness to be a nude model if you had the opportunity.

 

[Andolini]

A good percentage I would guess. There a lot a women walking around my city many more beautiful than Sofia. I have no way of knowing if they've all been offered the opportunity to pose nude but I'd guess many would not. Because many women have raised to value themselves for more than what is on the outside. I have a friend who is STUNNING and has been offered the opportunity to be a a real model not a nude and she said no. She became one the top students in her law school and went on to become a successful lawyer.


I have no comment on your willingness to be a nude model if you had the opportunity.

I also knew someone and she would never. And she needed the money, believe me. No comment on the latter part either

I can only imagine how scandalized some posters would have been had the internet existed in an earlier era at the knowledge that Prince Bertil of Sweden was living with a divorced former model from Wales and later married her and made her HRH Princess of Sweden and royal duchess. Gasp!! There would have been much clutching of pearls and reaching for smelling salts at the realization that time and society was moving on.

As far as I know, she did not do nude modeling

 

[HRHHermione]

As far as I know, she did not do nude modeling

But she did scandalous things for her time.

Which was the point.

 

[Andolini]

But she did scandalous things for her time.

Which was the point.

I realize that. My point is that nude modeling is still not something I endorse as a person. That is all. I do not and will not find it acceptable. I believe it objectifies women and there is enough of that in society already, in films,ads, tv, movies. If that makes me "an old fogie" so be it, but I happen to think people need to respect women a little bit more than panting over pages of nude pictures, it is disrespectful.

 

[AristoCat]

As far as I know, she did not do nude modeling

Back then, there were no other ways for women to survive, unless they had either been born wealthy or prominent to be able to live well idly or marry a fellow member of the working class. Lillian did the best she could during her circumstances and time and that is why I'm less judgmental. If a woman didn't have family, sometimes they became showgirls or actresses and lived disreputable lives.

As for Sofia, this is a different era and a different time in which women are able to work at honest work and still be considered completely respectable and more than worthy of a good man and be able to become a princess via marriage, but Sofia chooses to take the easy route and by inference, suggest that a normal job is supposed to be secondary to using sexual salesmanship to get, land, and keep a man until you can sweet talk marriage.

 

[HRHHermione]

A good percentage I would guess. There a lot a women walking around my city many more beautiful than Sofia. I have no way of knowing if they've all been offered the opportunity to pose nude but I'd guess many would not. Because many women have raised to value themselves for more than what is on the outside. I have a friend who is STUNNING and has been offered the opportunity to be a a real model not a nude and she said no. She became one the top students in her law school and went on to become a successful lawyer. I have more stories of women who are commercially gorgeous but have chosen to become successful by the merit of the brains over thei assets of their bodies.

For what it's worth I think CP will marry Sofia, and again, I wish the SRF the best.


I have no comment on your willingness to be a nude model if you had the opportunity.

I REALLY really hate when people present it as an either/or and imply that if you're a woman who enjoys your sexuality and your looks, that you can't be someone who cares about making it for your brain and your inner attributes at the same time. It seems to be how women internalize the madonna/whore complex and I just don't get it.

To them I say: time to spend some time studying Hedy Lamarr, who participated in one of the most scandalous films of her day- and yes, posed nude- and who later patented the technology that helped create stealth missiles.

In fact, I'd say this is a must read for anyone who believes that a woman should be defined for her entire life by the fact that she once posed nude:

Scandals of Classic Hollywood: The Ecstasy of Hedy Lamarr | The Hairpin

 

[NGalitzine]

As far as I know, she did not do nude modeling

True, but in the 40s and 50s many people in Europe considered any modeling to be not quite respectable. Much like stewardess were once thought of as "coffee, tea or me" kind of ladies.

 

[AristoCat]

I don't know how repentant she really is; if she hadn't dated a prince, I believe she would still be doing stuff like this since this was apparently her preferred method of making a living despite so many other ways out there.

 

[Frelinghighness]

Thanks HRHHermione for mentioning Hedy Lemarr, what a remarkable woman and a beauty.
I know a few models very well. They aren't stupid at all and not everyone can model. Just because you are stunning doesn't mean you are photogenic, and just because you are photogenic, doesn't mean you are comfortable in front of a camera and make it look easy and natural. Modeling is a gift and a talent, all gifts should be used to their fullest if possible.
BTW, I think Sophia is neither pretty nor photogenic. I think she always looks goofy in pictures. I was surprised to learn she was a model.

 

[Roslyn]

I REALLY really hate when people present it as an either/or and imply that if you're a woman who enjoys your sexuality and your looks, that you can't be someone who cares about making it for your brain and your inner attributes at the same time. It seems to be how women internalize the madonna/whore complex and I just don't get it.

To them I say: time to spend some time studying Hedy Lamarr, who participated in one of the most scandalous films of her day- and yes, posed nude- and who later patented the technology that helped create stealth missiles.

In fact, I'd say this is a must read for anyone who believes that a woman should be defined for her entire life by the fact that she once posed nude:

Scandals of Classic Hollywood: The Ecstasy of Hedy Lamarr | The Hairpin

I totally agree!

And thank you so much for that fabulous link to the story about Hedy Lamarr. I've skimmed the first part of it and look forward to enjoying the whole thing later.

 

[dbarn67]

I REALLY really hate when people present it as an either/or and imply that if you're a woman who enjoys your sexuality and your looks, that you can't be someone who cares about making it for your brain and your inner attributes at the same time. It seems to be how women internalize the madonna/whore complex and I just don't get it.

To them I say: time to spend some time studying Hedy Lamarr, who participated in one of the most scandalous films of her day- and yes, posed nude- and who later patented the technology that helped create stealth missiles.

In fact, I'd say this is a must read for anyone who believes that a woman should be defined for her entire life by the fact that she once posed nude:

Scandals of Classic Hollywood: The Ecstasy of Hedy Lamarr | The Hairpin

Hate?! I don't that word around lightly so this is another comment that I choose not to respond to.


I didn't not say the two were mutually exclusive. What I wrote about were choices. I could care less about Hedy Lamarr with regard to this discussion.

 

[NGalitzine]

Since this discussion is rather circular with nothing new being added perhaps it should be tabled until such time as the couple announce their engagement and the court announces what her style and title will be.

 

[AristoCat]

Totally agree!

 

[Ish]

Hate?! I don't that word around lightly so this is another comment that I choose not to respond to. I didn't not say the two were mutually exclusive. What I wrote about were choices. I could care less about Hedy Lamarr with regard to this discussion.

I don't typically use the word hate lightly either, but I can agree with what HRHHermione is saying, right down to the word choice. While it may not have been your intention to say, or imply, that there are only two choices, a big issue with the way people seem to see Sofia relies on this idea that there are only two types of women; the virtuous, publicly chaste woman who would never publicly bare her body, and the immoral woman who does. The point is that it's not that simple, and while Sofia may have made choices different from how you or I would have made them in similar circumstances, simply having decided to publicly display her body and sexuality doesn't make her an immoral woman.

Someone said that Sofia could have, and should have, engaged in "honest" work. Many people have said that she needs to admit she's done something wrong. What I question is what is so dishonest about her past work? Is it in any way illegal? Was it harming herself or others? I get the debate about degradation towards women, but I don't agree with the conclusion that women choosing to pose nude is in itself degradation towards women.

Expanding that, what's about her having made out with another woman? I don't agree that Sofia should be condemned because of her past career as it was legal, so likewise I don't agree that Jenna Jameson should be condemned for hers, as it's also legal. Them having made out doesn't scream immoral or wrong to me so much as it says that they view sex and sexuality differently from how I do. They don't have the same attitudes, they may not fit into the confines of the very narrow definitions towards sexuality that most people have.

Personally, I know some very well educated individuals who at glance you would consider to be productive, contributing, and moral members of society, who have in their private, personal lives engaged in relationships (both casual and serious) that most definitely would not fit within the narrow definitions commonly used. Does that mean they're somehow less than you or I? No, sorry. I don't believe so.

 

[HRHHermione]

I don't typically use the word hate lightly either, but I can agree with what HRHHermione is saying, right down to the word choice. While it may not have been your intention to say, or imply, that there are only two choices, a big issue with the way people seem to see Sofia relies on this idea that there are only two types of women; the virtuous, publicly chaste woman who would never publicly bare her body, and the immoral woman who does. The point is that it's not that simple, and while Sofia may have made choices different from how you or I would have made them in similar circumstances, simply having decided to publicly display her body and sexuality doesn't make her an immoral woman.

Someone said that Sofia could have, and should have, engaged in "honest" work. Many people have said that she needs to admit she's done something wrong. What I question is what is so dishonest about her past work? Is it in any way illegal? Was it harming herself or others? I get the debate about degradation towards women, but I don't agree with the conclusion that women choosing to pose nude is in itself degradation towards women.

Expanding that, what's about her having made out with another woman? I don't agree that Sofia should be condemned because of her past career as it was legal, so likewise I don't agree that Jenna Jameson should be condemned for hers, as it's also legal. Them having made out doesn't scream immoral or wrong to me so much as it says that they view sex and sexuality differently from how I do. They don't have the same attitudes, they may not fit into the confines of the very narrow definitions towards sexuality that most people have.

Personally, I know some very well educated individuals who at glance you would consider to be productive, contributing, and moral members of society, who have in their private, personal lives engaged in relationships (both casual and serious) that most definitely would not fit within the narrow definitions commonly used. Does that mean they're somehow less than you or I? No, sorry. I don't believe so.

Yes, exactly- that's what I meant and I agree. I know some lovely, intelligent, educated people whose private lives would probably shock many, and yet nothing they do is illegal or hurtful.

 

[Ish]

This quote from the article that HRHHermione posted is, in my opinion, extremely relevant to this discussion:

The face obscured the intelligence, the wit, the desire for something more. It became the synecdoche for her image, the whole of self. And it's not like we don't do this to women today: forcefully, if subconsciously mapping a desired vision of who they are and what they represent from a collection of paparazzi shots, publicity photos, and bad interviews. We do it to the girl whose beautiful and by herself at the concert, we do it to the student in our classes with the sorority shirt and bitchface. I do it to Megan Fox and Olivia Wilde and Kim Kardashian; you may do it to your own slew of beautiful, desirable, and thus easily dismissed women.

Emphasis (and any typos) mine.

 

[Moonmaiden23]

did she use twittter to announce her relationship with the Prince?

Yes, indeed she did. It went like this...

"......Wanna know a secret? I'm dating the Prince!"

 

[Dman]

Don't know if that's true but, if so, then that's refreshing. I think Chelsy dumped Harry on Facebook a while back.

 

[Ish]

Yes, indeed she did. It went like this... "......Wanna know a secret? I'm dating the Prince!"

If that's true (I can't find any sources saying such), then I agree that it's tacky but also very... Well, celebrity-esque of her. We have to remember that Sofia wasn't just a random commoner, or even a royal herself. She was a celebrity prior to her relationship (and is now in that awkward famous and in between being a celebrity and a royal stage), and acted like celebrities do.

Does she still tweet about her relationship? Do we have any reason to believe that when she made that tweet (or any subsequent tweets, or any interview comments, or what have you) that she did so without the approval of her partner? I'm not saying that she needs to ask for his permission, but more of a "hey do you mind if I do this?" Do we know if CP objects to anything Sofia has ever said about their relationship? I'm not saying that he does or that he doesn't, but if he doesn't then it seems to me that we don't really have reason to complain. I mean, if the person whose life is the one being displayed doesn't see anything wrong with it, who are we to object?

I do get what's being said about the idea that Sofia is in her relationship with CP for the fame and attention, and subsequently she says more than a royal partner should. But unless we have reason to believe that CP isn't completely comfortable with what she's saying (it with her saying anything at all) I don't necessarily agree that this is a problem. It's the same with Charlotte Casiraghi and Gad; we assume that since their previous partners were more discreet that their current, less discreet partners are only in it for the fame and that their behaviour is unwanted. I'm not sure if it's fair to compare Sofia to CP's past relationships and to assume that since CP's last girlfriend was discreet then his current girlfriend is going against his wishes by not being discreet.

 

[LadyFinn]

True, but in the 40s and 50s many people in Europe considered any modeling to be not quite respectable. Much like stewardess were once thought of as "coffee, tea or me" kind of ladies.

We don't know how much modeling Lilian did, when she sometimes worked as a mannequin. And we haven't heard that she would have constantly tried to get to the press or radio to be famous. Times were also different then. But obviously Sofia would have all the chances to study and live "normal" life like her two sisters, who have studied and taken exams.
Sofia also attended at the first Paradise Hotel in Sweden, the reality-shows weren't then so popular than now, although Big Brother had started in Sweden earlier.

 

[Moonmaiden23]

It always surprises me how people's expectation of royals is that they are "perfect". and how harsh people are on anyone who is not royal or noble daring to marry into a reigning family. Daniel, Catherine, Camilla, Mette Marit, Maxima, Letitiza, and Charlene to name a few. And then the praise for Stephanie and Matilde just because they are noble.

then there is the picking over of their physical appearance, past, families, work, work ethic, friends and finances.

Finding someone to share your life with is hard enough, but then there is all this stuff on top.

but what gets my goat is how very unforgiving some posters are. If current behaviour was so bad that it had a negative impact on the SRF, I would understand but it isn't.

Based on some views on here, new members of RFs who are excellent ambassadors ( Daniel and Mette Marit for example) would have been shown the door.

Carl should marry his girl and be happy and continue to carry out royal duties if that is what they both want.

Mathilde and Stephanie were not presented to the public until the day they became engaged. And if there had been any dirt to have been found on them, the tabloids would not have sat on the info just because they were from the nobility.. Prince Felipe's very noble girlfriend Isabel Sartorius was disqualified because she had divorced, shady parents.

Mathilde and Stephanie were not praised because they were aristocrats. They were praised for being intelligent, well educated and modest, uncontroversial. The fact that there was no controversy was refreshing to some, boring to many others.

They were also not criticized because there were no divorces and rumors of abortions(Letizia), no dragged out ten year courtship, with a coke snorting uncle blabbing to the tabloids(Kate) no controversial fascist father(Maxima) no single mother/ wild drug abusing party girl(Mette-Marit) no junior high school dropout apparently unable to learn French even after six continuous years in Monaco as the sovereign Prince's financially kept girlfriend(Charlene), no adulterous, multi decade affairs complete with divorces and recorded illicit phone conversations(Camilla)

The tabloids did uncover a family feud between Mathilde's father and uncle, and the fact that Guillaume and his fiancée Stephanie had not made love at the time of the engagement and that she was apparently a-gasp!-virgin. But that was it.

While there was approval online that they were well bred noblewomen, I well remember an equal amount of criticism that they were frumpy and boring.

BTW...the newest Royal bride Claire Lademacher is a nouveau riche non-aristocrat. If criticism is only leveled at commoners, why has there been virtually NONE of Claire?

 

[Princess Xenia]

Mathilde and Stephanie were not presented to the public until the day they became engaged. And if there had been any dirt to have been found on them, the tabloids would not have sat on the info just because they were from the nobility.. Prince Felipe's very noble girlfriend Isabel Sartorius was disqualified because she had divorced, shady parents. Mathilde and Stephanie were not praised because they were aristocrats. They were praised for being intelligent, well educated and modest, uncontroversial. The fact that there was no controversy was refreshing to some, boring to many others. They were also not criticized because there were no divorces and rumors of abortions(Letizia), no dragged out ten year courtship, with a coke snorting uncle blabbing to the tabloids(Kate) no controversial fascist father(Maxima) no single mother/ wild drug taking party girl(Mette-Marit) no junior high school dropout apparently unable to learn French even after six continuous years in Monaco as the sovereign Prince's financially kept girlfriend(Charlene), no adulterous, multi decade affairs complete with divorces and recorded illicit phone conversations(Camilla) The tabloids did uncover a family feud between Mathilde's father and uncle, and the fact that Guillaume and his fiancée Stephanie had not made love at the time of the engagement and that she was apparently a-gasp!-virgin. But that was it. While there was approval online that they were well bred noblewomen, I well remember an equal amount of criticism that they were frumpy and boring. BTW...the newest Royal bride Claire Lademacher is a nouveau rich non-aristocrat. If criticism is only leveled at commoners, why has there been virtually NONE of Claire?

Thank you for your great comment. I completely agree with you.
I guess we all have past criticising someone because he/she is a commoner or only because she is a woman. What is important in judging that a person is worthy of her future
role is to see what has she achieved in her life so far. Although some of these now royal women have proved us that we were wrong, we still have the opportunity to talk about the achievements of the possible future royals.

 

[Andolini]

I remember I was shocked when Guillame's engagement was announced. I was like "Huh? He was dating someone?" LOL and the same goes for Mathilde and Phillipe. Out of the blue, a great many people were surprised.

 

[angieuk]

Is it true his previous girlfriend is now married to someone else? If so, what a shame, she seemed so suitable for the role.

 

[KitKat2006]

I'm not sure if she's married already. But she has a kid with her new boyfriend/husband.

 

[LadyFinn]

Is it true his previous girlfriend is now married to someone else? If so, what a shame, she seemed so suitable for the role.

Emma Pernald got engaged with her boyfriend Tomas Jonson in May 2012. In September 2012 Emma gave birth to their first child, son named Arthur, the baby was born three weeks before it was due. Emma and Tomas applied for the Certificate of No Impediment and Marriage licence from the Swedish Tax Agency about ten days after Madeleine's wedding. The marriage licence is needed if one is getting married abroad. There hasn't been any information about Emma and Tomas getting married at the swedish press.

 

[AristoCat]

Any bets as to when the engagement will be announced.