Duke and Duchess of Cambridge: Platinum Jubilee Tour of The Caribbean 19-26 Mar 2022


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I grew up in the Caribbean. So I say this out of a concern for an area of the world I still love- I assumed that both countries would be heavily using the publicity of the royals as a way of advertising "book a trip, come visit, we're open and ready!" Instead, that message has been swallowed up by other headlines.

I think this will likely be a royal tour of missed opportunities and frustrations for more than just Kate & William. I don't think either of the host countries is getting what they wanted out of this, by no fault of the Cambridges.

I do think the Cambridges need to reflect on what their side could have done better though, for future tours. I can't articulate it properly, but this tour doesn't have the completeness that the tour of Pakistan did and reminds me more of tours the Cambridges did early in their marriage.
 
BriarRose said:
I grew up in the Caribbean. So I say this out of a concern for an area of the world I still love- I assumed that both countries would be heavily using the publicity of the royals as a way of advertising "book a trip, come visit, we're open and ready!" Instead, that message has been swallowed up by other headlines.

I think this will likely be a royal tour of missed opportunities and frustrations for more than just Kate & William. I don't think either of the host countries is getting what they wanted out of this, by no fault of the Cambridges.

I do think the Cambridges need to reflect on what their side could have done better though, for future tours. I can't articulate it properly, but this tour doesn't have the completeness that the tour of Pakistan did and reminds me more of tours the Cambridges did early in their marriage.
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I think you're giving the Cambridges too much power here. It's not like they can go and say "we want to do this, we have to visit that, we have to talk with these people". The tour is organized and negotiated on a government level between UK and hosting country.

Yes, their personal interests are taken into consideration. No, they can't do everything they want.

There are things the Cambridges might have done better on this tour, especially their comms people. But as far as the substance of the tour, it has to be agreed by everyone. And it seems pretty clear what the agenda of the host countries have been with this one.
 
wbenson said:
He may just not have received the actual full-size medal yet. I think miniatures and ribbons can be worn as soon as an honour is awarded, even before the physical insignia is received. (I doubt there will be an investiture or anything like that, but I don't know that the medals have been mailed out or whatever. I don't think there have been any other uniform events since the 6th of February so I don't know what the others have.)

His medals are court-mounted, so they're a single unit that attaches to the uniform, meaning he couldn't be missing just one due to a packing error. I suppose it's possible that someone neglected to have his medals sent out for remounting (worse mistakes have been made).
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I read an explanation on twitter which says that the miniature and ribbon can be worn but the full size medal can’t be worn until June unless the parade is attended by the Queen

So for St Patricks day when he was in uniform - William wore the ribbon
 
I think that's what Belize was doing. I know questions were raised about visiting beaches, scuba diving sites and archaeological sites, but the authorities there were trying to showcase their tourist attractions to the international media. It's unfortunate that there was the issue with the cocoa plantation, but that was really the fault of the local authorities for not consulting the tribal leaders. Jamaica's been a lot more awkward, but I think a lot of that is due to politicking by Jamaica's PM. If he's so anti-royal, why agree to the tour in the first place, unless he wanted to make things look bad? And there have been plenty of people cheering them and shouting "We love you" etc, as well.

They must feel like they can't do right for doing wrong.
 
Yes, I did not blame the Cambridges. In fact, the words "no fault" were used by me to describe them.

But do I think their team did its best work on this tour, regardless of the political machinations outside of their control? No, I don't think they did, as I said above. If we are comparing all of their tours, I think their team could have done a better job preparing, planning, and negotiating. There is power in preparing, planning, and negotiating, when it is done well.
 
The actual locals they've met and showcased have been great and happy to see them and show them and whoever is following their hard work. However it can't not be awkward and dominate the news cycle when the PM tells you to your face that the reason they wanted you here was to demonstrate how not wanted you are.

It doesn't help when the media also try and create more controversy when there isn't any.

I also fail to see how this tour is so "outdated/colonial" etc when William did a visit to the UAE six weeks ago which was also under British control at one point and there wasn't a peep about how inappropriate it was.

Belize's tourism campaign has actually worked on me. It wasn't a place I'd considered going before but it is now.
 
Well, once you cut through all the noise, I think overall it's been a successful tour and it's been fun to follow along and see the Cambridges out in the world again.

I'll leave my opinions of the entire Jamaican PM debacle out of this and just say that William and, especially, Catherine have done a great job maintaining their smiles and warmth through some difficult moments. They've always looked friendly and interested even through the more uncomfortable moments. That is the best anyone could ask!

Still, it's nice to see the welcoming nature of the Bahamanian PM and his wife in contrast to Jamaica. You could tell it was a more relaxed atmosphere and both couples seemed to be laughing and enjoying the moment! And the flower girl at airport was adorable.

I have a feeling this may be the best leg of the tour. They've only got a couple of more days until they are home and it seems like a less high pressure environment. Really looking forward to them getting to sail tomorrow and I'm sure they are too!
 
Jan Moir’s view of this tour from the rag the Daily Fail.
She seems to have suddenly realised that once the Queen is gone the full tide of history will be turning and all bets are off!

From the article.

?What this week showed is that the days of the big royal overseas visit are surely numbered.

The very idea that the Royal Family should sally forth, in all their finery and jewels, to faraway lands to meet people they expect to bow and curtsey to them, or pay homage at the very least, is an increasing absurdity.

The royals on the road? It is like a band going on a farewell tour to play their greatest hits, only to discover that no one is listening any more, that the fans are moving to a different drumbeat. It is not over yet, not quite.

However, this week we glimpsed the royal future post-Queen ? and it is not looking bright.? Quote.
 
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Curryong said:
Jan Moir’s view of this tour from the rag the Daily Fail.
She seems to have suddenly realised that once the Queen is gone the full tide of history will be turning and all bets are off!

From the article.

?What this week showed is that the days of the big royal overseas visit are surely numbered.

The very idea that the Royal Family should sally forth, in all their finery and jewels, to faraway lands to meet people they expect to bow and curtsey to them, or pay homage at the very least, is an increasing absurdity.

The royals on the road? It is like a band going on a farewell tour to play their greatest hits, only to discover that no one is listening any more, that the fans are moving to a different drumbeat. It is not over yet, not quite.

However, this week we glimpsed the royal future post-Queen ? and it is not looking bright.? Quote.
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I am not quite sure that one visit that was heavily scrutinised means that it is 'the end' for these kind of tours. This too will pass. Obviously some lessons will be learned and some activities and some optics will not be repeated for other visits, but that is always the case.
 
I think the negatives of this tour are a foreshadowing of things to come once the Queen dies. Many older generations in the Commonwealth have allegiance to the Queen and that is it.

The monarchy will be fine and they will adapt like they always have.
 
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"Earlier in a private meeting with Prime Minister Davis and his wife, Prince William and Duchess Kate were gifted a beautiful portrait hand painted by Bahamian Celebrity Artist Jamaal Rolle. "

https://twitter.com/x/status/1507120771738521606

"Prime Minister Davis gives details on how his courtesy call with the Duke and Duchess of Cambridge went earlier this evening."

https://twitter.com/x/status/1507135576440459274

"The Duke & Duchess of Cambridge are visiting The Bahamas in commemoration of the Queen's 70th, and are sailing in a regatta with local boats. Here is what the sailors participating in the race had to say as they prepared their vessels."

https://twitter.com/x/status/1507025550417678338
 
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Alisa said:
I think the negatives of this tour are a foreshadowing of things to come once the Queen dies. Many older generations in the Commonwealth have allegiance to the Queen and that is it.

The monarchy will be fine and they will adapt like they always have.
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I don't think we should extrapolate the peculiar circumstances of Jamaica to the rest of the Commonwealth realms. In Canada and even in realms such as Australia where a large percentage of the population is presumably in favor of a republic, recent royal tours have gone smoothly and been actually quite successful. I suspect that the decision of the Jamaican PM to play political games with the tour (which BTW was organized on the invitation of the Jamaican government) will probably backfire domestically.

The situation is understandable though. Jamaica is one of the poorest English-speaking Caribbean nations with nominal per capita GDP around 5,000 US dollars compared for example to 34,000 US dollars in the nearby Bahamas. Rather than facing Jamaica's own domestic problems, it is easier to look for scapegoats such as colonialism.
 
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https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...-fly-storm-Caribbean-Royals-land-Bahamas.html

While everybody agrees that the Cambridges made the most of their task, maybe it had to be experienced or seen to believe that royal tours in the current set up will have no place in a modern monarchy.

William and Kate are the future of the BRF and hopefully they will draw their conclusion from what they felt or the public perception of this whole thing. The 'colonial touch' has to go for sure.
 
do you think that diplomatic relations cemented by royal or presidenetial visits are going to stop?
 
Denville said:
do you think that diplomatic relations cemented by royal or presidenetial visits are going to stop?
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no of course not but they have to be careful what kind of pictures they produce, the driving in the land rover should be left with QEII, greeting people behind fences or the "native acitivies", was fun with Charles dancing decades ago but not in 2022 anymore.
Maybe other RFs do this as well but they don't have that kind of 'Empire heritage'.
They need to focus on everything that represents the future, not that past.
 
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Mbruno said:
I don't think we should extrapolate the peculiar circumstances of Jamaica to the rest of the Commonwealth realms. In Canada and even in realms such as Australia where a large percentage of the population is presumably in favor of a republic, recent royal tours have gone smoothly and been actually quite successful. I suspect that the decision of the Jamaican PM to play political games with the tour (which BTW was organized on the invitation of the Jamaican government) will probably backfire domestically.

The situation is understandable though. Jamaica is one of the poorest English-speaking Caribbean nations with nominal per capita GDP around 5,000 US dollars compared for example to 34,000 US dollars in the nearby Bahamas. Rather than facing Jamaica's own domestic problems, it is easier to look for scapegoats such as colonialism.
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This. Jamaica and the Bahamas are very different countries.
 
I think more could have been highlighted of William’s Earthshot prize and environmental work. We got the video of the diving in Belize but i really think more could have been made during the whole trip of protecting and restoring our world.

Likewise i think future tours need to focus on their charity work, highlighting causes of the region, putting a spotlight on tourism and culture of the country.
 
PrincessofEurope said:
I think more could have been highlighted of William’s Earthshot prize and environmental work. We got the video of the diving in Belize but i really think more could have been made during the whole trip of protecting and restoring our world.

Likewise i think future tours need to focus on their charity work, highlighting causes of the region, putting a spotlight on tourism and culture of the country.
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I agree with you but keep in mind that the host nation might want to highlight other areas when the two countries negotiate and determine the tour itinerary.
 
A video from the departure from Jamaica yesterday

The duke and duchess today in the Bahamas
 
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PrincessofEurope said:
Watching this tour progress, I feel it has been a difficult tour and I don't necessarily think successful.

I feel the Cambridges bring fun, youth and a down to earth quality about them when they tour and so far I don't feel that has shone through as much as on previous tours - possibly due to the slightly tense situation and protests that have taken place
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I don’t think this was ever going to be a successful tour in the way that the majority of their other visits have been. Everything could have gone perfectly and the press would still have found a way to work colonialism and/or racism into the narrative and choose to present the whole thing through that lens. I’m sure William, Catherine and their team knew this was going to happen and that, to a large extent, there wasn’t anything they could do about it.

They wouldn’t have been thrown off by the protests as those are nothing new - there are almost always protests in Quebec whenever members of the Royal Family come to Canada, for example.

The treatment they got in Jamaica was shameful and reflects very poorly on the government of Jamaica, but William and Catherine handled the situation correctly and carried on.

It’s too bad that a tour in which they were very warmly received the majority of the time has been overshadowed by these negatives but I think all the couple and their team can do is take a look at things they had control over and might have done differently, and make use of that experience going forward.
 
PrincessofEurope said:
I think more could have been highlighted of William’s Earthshot prize and environmental work. We got the video of the diving in Belize but i really think more could have been made during the whole trip of protecting and restoring our world.

Likewise i think future tours need to focus on their charity work, highlighting causes of the region, putting a spotlight on tourism and culture of the country.
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Given that this trip is not to promote their own interests but to celebrate the queen's platinum jubilee, imho it would be a very bad idea if they would have made it all about their personal interests (such as environment and early childhood); those issues can be left for other trips (such as the one Catherine recently made to Denmark).
 
Mbruno said:
I don't think we should extrapolate the peculiar circumstances of Jamaica to the rest of the Commonwealth realms. In Canada and even in realms such as Australia where a large percentage of the population is presumably in favor of a republic, recent royal tours have gone smoothly and been actually quite successful. I suspect that the decision of the Jamaican PM to play political games with the tour (which BTW was organized on the invitation of the Jamaican government) will probably backfire domestically.
Click to expand...

Actually we can extrapolate this. Until recently only the "big" countries like Canada and Australia would have notable protest. The very fact that the smaller Caribbean nations too are voicing discord with being a part of the Commonwealth is very significant.

[
Mbruno said:
The situation is understandable though. Jamaica is one of the poorest English-speaking Caribbean nations with nominal per capita GDP around 5,000 US dollars compared for example to 34,000 US dollars in the nearby Bahamas. Rather than facing Jamaica's own domestic problems, it is easier to look for scapegoats such as colonialism.
Click to expand...

The above is classic imperialism narrative and untrue. Jamaica's GDP per capita is almost double the 5,000 you posted. Moreover the country has made great strides and have been successful in making leeway in other profitable areas besides tourism. Jamaica does have very serious problems but their progress is not to be discounted.
 
The Surinamese press reports that the duke of Cambridge awarded the 'Overseas Sword' to a Surinamese cadet of the National Army who attended the Initial Officer Training Programme van de Caribbean Military Academy (CMA) in Jamaica.
 
Alsa said:
Actually we can extrapolate this. Until recently only the "big" countries like Canada and Australia would have notable protest. The very fact that the smaller Caribbean nations too are voicing discord with being a part of the Commonwealth is very significant.
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They are not voicing discord about being a "part of the Commonwealth". They are voicing discord about retaining the Queen as Head of State, which is a completely different issue. As far as I know, the Jamaican government wants Jamaica to remain a member of the Commonwealth after it becomes a republic. In fact, the vast majority of the Commonwealth members (34 out of 54 countries ?) are republics.





The above is classic imperialism narrative and untrue. Jamaica's GDP per capita is almost double the 5,000 you posted. Moreover the country has made great strides and have been successful in making leeway in other profitable areas besides tourism. Jamaica does have very serious problems but their progress is not to be discounted.
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No it is not. Jamaica's nominal per capita GDP in 2018 was US$ 5,393 according to Wikipedia, exactly as I posted. Maybe you are confusing nominal per capita GDP with Purchasing Power Parity (PPP) per capita GDP, which was US$ 9,434 in the same year.



If you prefer to use more recent data, Jamaica's nominal per capita GDP in 2021 was US$ 5,422 according to the IMF.
 
Mbruno said:
They are not voicing discord about being a "part of the Commonwealth". They are voicing discord about retaining the Queen as Head of State, which is a completely different issue. As far as I know, the Jamaican government wants Jamaica to remain a member of the Commonwealth after it becomes a republic. In fact, the vast majority of the Commonwealth members (34 out of 54 countries ?) are republics.








No it is not. Jamaica's nominal per capita GDP in 2018 was US$ 5,393 according to Wikipedia, exactly as I posted. Maybe you are confusing nominal per capita GDP with Purchasing Power Parity (PPP) per capita GDP, which was US$ 9,434 in the same year.



If you prefer to use more recent data, Jamaica's nominal per capita GDP in 2021 was US$ 5,422 according to the IMF.
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Thanks for pointing out this out that Jamaica and other nations that currently have the British monarch as their Head of State are not necessarily choosing to leave the Commonwealth. No nation is required to be a part of it and can choose to leave if they wish. Also it is not necessary for a nation to have been a part of the old British Empire.


https://thecommonwealth.org/about-us


The Commonwealth is a voluntary association of 54 independent and equal countries.
It is home to 2.5 billion people, and includes both advanced economies and developing countries. 32 of our members are small states, including many island nations.
Our member governments have agreed to shared goals like development, democracy and peace. Our values and principles are expressed in the Commonwealth Charter.
The Commonwealth's roots go back to the British Empire. But today any country can join the modern Commonwealth. The last country to join the Commonwealth was Rwanda in 2009.
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There needs to be a very real, honest, frank analysis in house (and likely including plenty of outside voices to) as to why this tour wasn't (or wasn't perceived at least) as a success.
It was always going to be tricky - visiting a country that openly wants to get rid of the Sovereign as their head of state, visiting Caribbean countries after all the allegations of racism, first overseas visit in years and first when many many people back home haven't left for a holiday overseas for years.

I think there are a whole host of reasons why this didn't work out well (a rare miss for the RF and W&K): lack of staff experience planning such tours, an inept Foreign Office that can't handle anything well, visiting one country where the government isn't exactly going to go out their way to make the visit a success, the current events in the world meaning we just aren't in place to be that bothered about such a tour, the media and rise of social media influence, the feeling in the media perhaps of the need to reflect some of the harshest social media criticism in their coverage even if that criticism comes from people with their own agenda. I would even look as closely at small things - the wardrobe (Catherine's very "English" clothing which creates an awkward juxtapose and William in brilliant white uniform - yes required but again doesn't look good), the social media team at KP and their posts and many others.

I don't for one minute thing this was as bad as some people and media are making out but it does need looking at very carefully.
 
tommy100 said:
There needs to be a very real, honest, frank analysis in house (and likely including plenty of outside voices to) as to why this tour wasn't (or wasn't perceived at least) as a success.
It was always going to be tricky - visiting a country that openly wants to get rid of the Sovereign as their head of state, visiting Caribbean countries after all the allegations of racism, first overseas visit in years and first when many many people back home haven't left for a holiday overseas for years.

I think there are a whole host of reasons why this didn't work out well (a rare miss for the RF and W&K): lack of staff experience planning such tours, an inept Foreign Office that can't handle anything well, visiting one country where the government isn't exactly going to go out their way to make the visit a success, the current events in the world meaning we just aren't in place to be that bothered about such a tour, the media and rise of social media influence, the feeling in the media perhaps of the need to reflect some of the harshest social media criticism in their coverage even if that criticism comes from people with their own agenda. I would even look as closely at small things - the wardrobe (Catherine's very "English" clothing which creates an awkward juxtapose and William in brilliant white uniform - yes required but again doesn't look good), the social media team at KP and their posts and many others.

I don't for one minute thing this was as bad as some people and media are making out but it does need looking at very carefully.
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I think the lack of experience from both their entourage and the foreign office was apparent but this was a no win situation tbh.
They received the invitation from those countries and organized the trip accordingly, trying to adjust the personal interests of the couple with what the Country want to highlight on an international scale (tourist attraction for instance). What is unclar to me is what they wanted to highlight in Jamaica, for instance. To me, it looked like a huge pot stirring. The grandiosity of the ceremonies was so odd for a country that is so open and vocal about becoming a republic. A more understated dinner (without the orders and the medals) like in Belize would have sufficed. Same goes for the parade: it is them who arranged for the Land Rover, not the other way around.

As for the "ackward" wardrobe: what were they supposed to wear? Imagine going for something traditional, they would have been accused of cultural appropriation. They wore what is traditional in UK under the same circumstance...
I think sometimes the "colonialism" is in the eyes of the beholder but optics are not facts and part of the responsibility lies in the partial reporting: taking pictures out of context, not explaining and implying hasn't done the tour any favour.
 
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