Diana/Charles/Camilla's Relationships Part 2

[ysbel]

Thanks Princejohnny! Its Queen Alexandra but I'm having a little trouble with the size. Hoping the avatar fairy will drop by!

As you see, the avatar fairy did arrive in the form of Elspeth and Norwegianne.

So I hope you all can see Queen Alexandra a lot better now.

Thanks Norwegianne and Elspeth!

 

[Skydragon]

So I hope you all can see Queen Alexandra a lot better now.

Yes very clearly now, many congratulations.

 

[ksenia]

A question about adultery

If this is off topic please delete it.

In another thread I can't locate it now, someone made the comment that all of the rumors and news about the affairs etc were made from the diana camp. Camilla and her friends remained quiet. I think that was a good strategy for Camilla because what would she have said anyway. "yes I am committing adultery with a married man and this is my justification for it" It would have done a lot more damage to her image than she was already sustaining.

I think that is one reason people we can not let go of the triangle. It seems unfair that after commiting such a crime against the institution of marriage you marry your accomplice and now everyone is supposed to forget it happened and applaud you while the "victim" is dead. We really want the happy ending and although this is not perfect at least 2 of the three are happy and the other seemed content with her life in the end. As my mother says " they have paid for their mistakes and anyway it is their life." so no matter what your personal feeling towards the couple- mine are pretty mixed I confess- we should stop punishing them.

think of it as if it were you- maybe not in the same situation but comparable- and the world never letting you live down your past mistakes.

 

[love_cc]

If Diana were still alive and remarried, things will be much easier for Charles and Camilla. Charles and Camilla remarried and Camilla becomes HRH the Duchess of Cornwall and Princess of Wales by the law, but Diana died without living happily. So it made many people feel unfair for the three. Once the three parties were all gone, the comments and feelings will be much different.

I am trying to think about Charles and Camilla in a long term period. I have a thought, Camilla and Charles did suffer a lot during the past 35 years. They two has been always reminded that they cannot get married because Charles will be the King. Think about Camilla's feeling when she witnessed Charles' first marriage. and think about Charles's feelings when he was in the sea in 1973-1974. Charles and Camilla wanted to retain their feelings for each other and they had to pay the highest cost for the exlclusive love they want.

 

[Skydragon]

It seems unfair that after commiting such a crime against the institution of marriage you marry your accomplice and now everyone is supposed to forget it happened and applaud you while the "victim" is dead.
.

I also think it depends on who you believe had the affair first. I also believe that if the truth about the amount of affairs were ever to come out, people might think differently about who the victim was.
As has been shown this weekend, Charles and Camilla are still being punished by some.

 

[Margrethe II]

They are both victims of a joint inability to communicate openly. They were both known to walk away from a situation, let it fester and sulk in a self absorbed state. This is not healthy for any kind of relationship, let alone a marriage.

Both were known for their fiery tempers and stubbornness, so if there is to be no common ground obtained let alone reached…

There is no doubt that the display of marital unhappiness and disparity were the result of a mutual despair. Where to go? What to do from here? It was written all over their faces.

To solely blame one individual is totally & utterly unfair.

"MII"

 

[Skydragon]

To solely blame one individual is totally & utterly unfair.

"MII"

I couldn't agree more!

 

[Warren]

To solely blame one individual is totally & utterly unfair.
"MII"

Which is probably the attitude most people have. Unfortunately within the context of this thread there are those who are intent on apportioning "blame" to one side or the other in a most dogmatic way. The outcome of staking out positions in this manner is the unpleasant tit for tat posting which saw this thread come close to being shut down the other day.

W

 

[Saragli]

Margareth said it the best. That is why I believe their is no point in discussing the affairs. The marriage collapsed because, and ONLY because, Charles and Diana could not work out their differences. They both went their seperate ways. They divorced and that chapter of their lives closed, before Diana died. There is no reason on bringing up the past. There is a new chapter in the monarchy and it is a bright one. There is a good future if people would move on.

 

[Skydragon]

The marriage collapsed because, and ONLY because, Charles and Diana could not work out their differences. They both went their separate ways. .

I can agree with that Princejonnhy25, When a husband or wife go looking for someone else, it is because there are problems within the marriage in the first place.

 

[una]

Charles, Camilla and Andrew were all very good friends and I think wanted Diana to become part of the adult social circle they, along with other friends, all belonged to. Diana's friends were all very young and immature.
What a 20 year old believes and understands is totally different from someone over 30, over 40, over 50 etc.

I agree that the age difference didn't help, but Diana had friends later on of the maternal sort that were older than her, like Raine Spencer, Annabel Goldsmith, Rosa Moncton, Lucia F de L. I think the problem was also to do with Di's lack of education which made her feel out of place and insecure, and differences in interest which left her bored. Also I think there was an element of jealousy. She called Ch's friends "oilers" who were always "kissing his feet", and it wasn't "good for him". She may have resented the fact that he was getting all the attention from them while she was being left out.

 

[una]

What makes you think Camilla was in love with Charles when he married Diana?

They were seen on a number of occasions dancing together all evening and kissing passionately dance after dance. Camilla was the woman on the train. However, Cam also said she was in love with Andrew at this time, so "whatever love means".

 

[ysbel]

Camilla was the woman on the train.

It's been said before in this thread but I guess its too long to go through, but there was never any confirmation which blonde was on the train with Charles right before the wedding. At the time, the press said it was Diana. Several said it was neither Diana or Camilla.

I haven't heard that they were dancing passionately or kissing each other right before or in the beginning of his marriage to Diana. Maybe you can get us some more info on that.

 

[branchg]

Diana later stated that both she and Charles made mistakes and shared equal responsibility for the failure of their marriage. To blame one or the other is pointless because it was complicated by many factors, including the media attention Diana courted as well as courtiers on both sides that fueled resentments for their own benefit.

 

[corazon]

It's been said before in this thread but I guess its too long to go through, but there was never any confirmation which blonde was on the train with Charles right before the wedding. At the time, the press said it was Diana. Several said it was neither Diana or Camilla.

I haven't heard that they were dancing passionately or kissing each other right before or in the beginning of his marriage to Diana. Maybe you can get us some more info on that.

not is usual that the palace confirm rumours like that. I cant imagine a palace annucement: ''yes, the women in the train was the mr. camilla parker bowles, she was to visit to prince of wales'' not have sense. About the train was a press rumour with photos.

 

[ysbel]

Well if no one has confirmed it, then no one can really say for sure that it is true. Wouldn't you agree, corazon?

 

[corazon]

Well if no one has confirmed it, then no one can really say for sure that it is true. Wouldn't you agree, corazon?

yes, no one can confirmed this.

 

[ksenia]

I also think it depends on who you believe had the affair first. I also believe that if the truth about the amount of affairs were ever to come out, people might think differently about who the victim was.
As has been shown this weekend, Charles and Camilla are still being punished by some.

it doesnt matter who did what, in both cases it is wrong.

 

[maryshawn]

The thing I think is important to remember are the accounts of how PCharles and PDiana became friends again and were on excellent terms--even planning a trip to Hong Kong together--before her death. He showed up at her apartment in Kensington one day wearing a tie she'd given him and from then on, showed up to chat. His status rose miles in my book when he fought so hard to ensure PDiana was treated with respect after her death and the way he travelled to Paris to collect her body and fly it home.

Again, time lends perspective. There was a lot of good PCharles and PDiana accomplished together--Prince William and Prince Harry are the primary examples. They travelled the world and inspired a lot of goodwill and renewed interest in the British royal family and industries in the UK. The good they did together is not lost.

 

[Skydragon]

Originally Posted by ksenia
It seems unfair that after commiting such a crime against the institution of marriage you marry your accomplice and now everyone is supposed to forget it happened and applaud you while the "victim" is dead.

Originally Posted by Skydragon
I also think it depends on who you believe had the affair first. I also believe that if the truth about the amount of affairs were ever to come out, people might think differently about who the victim was.
As has been shown this weekend, Charles and Camilla are still being punished by some.

it doesnt matter who did what, in both cases it is wrong.

If you believe that ksenia, then (I am genuinely curious) why your original post.

 

[una]

It's been said before in this thread but I guess its too long to go through, but there was never any confirmation which blonde was on the train with Charles right before the wedding.
I haven't heard that they were dancing passionately or kissing each other right before or in the beginning of his marriage to Diana. Maybe you can get us some more info on that.

This information is from Gyles Brandreth's book published this year. GB has spoken to Royal Family members and friends. He said the woman on the train was Camilla.
As for the passion, these occasions were birthday bashes beginning with Charles' birthday in 11/79 where their dancing was described by a guest as "electric"; the Queen Mother's birthday in the summer of '80 when they spent the entire evening dancing together; 2 more polo balls in the next month or two where they danced all evening, kissing passionately, dance after dance.
In the Dimbleby book, Charles and Camilla both accepted that his marriage would end their affair, but according to Dimbleby, Ch's feelings for Cam "had not changed". During the engagement Ch saw Cam once, to give her the bracelet. Charles told Diana about Camilla and told her he intended to be faithful in their marriage.

 

[Skydragon]

This information is from Gyles Brandreth's book published this year. GB has spoken to Royal Family members and friends. He said the woman on the train was Camilla.

There is no solid evidence to confirm that the woman was Diana, Camilla or anyone else. We are pretty sure that it was a media story only.

As for the passion, these occasions were birthday bashes beginning with Charles' birthday in 11/79 where their dancing was described by a guest as "electric"; the Queen Mother's birthday in the summer of '80 when they spent the entire evening dancing together; 2 more polo balls in the next month or two where they danced all evening, kissing passionately, dance after dance.
.

Now I have stopped laughing, I have to ask where on earth did you read such things? The dancing by EVERYONE could be described as energetic at most hunt balls. As for kissing passionately all evening, that was obviously written by someone who had never even attended such an event.
Who was the guest at all these events?

 

[WillowDawn]

I never said Diana was a saint. She responded in the wrong way to a philandering husband and a mistress who did not respect the late Princess Of Wale's marriage even before it began. Diana should have sought a divorce right away or better yet an annulment (at least a civil annulment-I don't think those are possible in the C of E-like in the C of R).

My sister did the same thing as Diana in response to a cheating husband-which is one reason this is such a sore point for me. Adultery causes so much pain, and heartache for all involved. It is like my sister said about 'the other woman'. 'What did I ever do to her that she would do this to me? I didn't even know her'. The same could be said in regards to Diana and Camilla. Camilla threw the first punch in my estimation. Along with Charles. Diana did not know how to fight back. Her own parents had a horrible marriage record.

I feel the same way you do about this whole thing as well. In MY book, you don't mess with a married man or woman, that is sacred ground.
Wouldn't it be ironic to see Charles find a much younger and prettier woman and cheat on Camilla??? Afterall, history does eventually repeat itself, and they do say what comes around eventually goes around.
Camilla and Charles both started the whole thing first, although all of them were all guilty. Tit for Tat never works for anyones benefit.
Camilla was just trying to take after her great great grandmother Alice Kepple, and obviously thought that being a mistress was
totally ok and accepted by everyone.

 

[Charlotte1]

This information is from Gyles Brandreth's book published this year. GB has spoken to Royal Family members and friends. He said the woman on the train was Camilla.
.

Charles' family members and friends were not on the train on the night in question. His valet Stephen Barry and 2 Royal Protection Officers were. Stephen Barry said there was no woman on the train. He also pointed out that Charles is rarely alone, where ever he is (when on duty as in the case of travelling on the Royal train to an engagement) SB was there and also 2 protection officers.

 

[Aussie Princess]

The thing I think is important to remember are the accounts of how PCharles and PDiana became friends again and were on excellent terms--even planning a trip to Hong Kong together--before her death. He showed up at her apartment in Kensington one day wearing a tie she'd given him and from then on, showed up to chat. His status rose miles in my book when he fought so hard to ensure PDiana was treated with respect after her death and the way he travelled to Paris to collect her body and fly it home.

Again, time lends perspective. There was a lot of good PCharles and PDiana accomplished together--Prince William and Prince Harry are the primary examples. They travelled the world and inspired a lot of goodwill and renewed interest in the British royal family and industries in the UK. The good they did together is not lost.

I agree with all of that! They may not have had the traditional fairy tale happy ever after ending, but they had made peace with each other, and I doubt they had regrets.

 

[Skydragon]

I feel the same way you do about this whole thing as well. In MY book, you don't mess with a married man or woman, that is sacred ground.
Wouldn't it be ironic to see Charles find a much younger and prettier woman and cheat on Camilla??? Afterall, history does eventually repeat itself, and they do say what comes around eventually goes around.
Camilla and Charles both started the whole thing first, although all of them were all guilty. Tit for Tat never works for anyones benefit.
Camilla was just trying to take after her great great grandmother Alice Kepple, and obviously thought that being a mistress was
totally ok and accepted by everyone.

They both had affairs and both admitted that it was after they realised that the marriage was over, are you suggesting that they both lied?

Charles seems to go for a woman he can hold a conversation with and who really shares the same interests, rather than a pretty younger type. I should think he would say, been there, done that, got the t-shirt.

How do you know what Camilla thought about being a mistress? Are you suggesting that Camilla never loved Charles and only wanted the notoriety of being a mistress, to the husband of woman who was hugely popular but, privately could IMO be very vindictive? That knowing all this, she did it for a laugh?

 

[ysbel]

As to which affair was worse, Charles' or Diana's, we've ALL been there, done that, got the T-Shirt and none of us likes how it turned out.

Arguing, name-calling, spitefulness, and general unpleasantness for everyone around.

Let's not go there again, shall we?

New members are encouraged to read some of the threads before posting. All of this has been discussed and fought over before.

ysbel
British forums moderator

 

[corazon]

I feel the same way you do about this whole thing as well. In MY book, you don't mess with a married man or woman, that is sacred ground.
Wouldn't it be ironic to see Charles find a much younger and prettier woman and cheat on Camilla??? Afterall, history does eventually repeat itself, and they do say what comes around eventually goes around.
Camilla and Charles both started the whole thing first, although all of them were all guilty. Tit for Tat never works for anyones benefit.
Camilla was just trying to take after her great great grandmother Alice Kepple, and obviously thought that being a mistress was
totally ok and accepted by everyone.

exactly! was more easy be a mistress that be a royal wife.

 

[Skydragon]

exactly! was more easy be a mistress that be a royal wife.

I am curious, how on earth would any of us know. I think it would have been much harder not being with the man you love. Knowing the terrible time he was having and being unable to help him.
Why would it be easier, in your opinion?

 

[corazon]

I am curious, how on earth would any of us know. I think it would have been much harder not being with the man you love. Knowing the terrible time he was having and being unable to help him.
Why would it be easier, in your opinion?

whena women married a prince she married with a position, with a duty, with a title and lost so things from her old live. Camilla have a unhappy marriage with andrew, but she not married charles when she can do (in the '70). diana have royal's sons etc ect and many responsabilites. Camilla even was with the man she love, before, during and later charles's marriage.