Criticisms of the Crown Princess and her family

[Mermaid1962]

It's a novel that is supposed to be a veiled biography of either Masako or the current Empress. I can't remember which. Perhaps it's discussed under the Royal Books section.

Oh, I've never heard about the book about which you mention here. What is it about ?

 

[Mermaid1962]

I've seen clips of Japanese game shoes where a dog's mouth is duct-taped shut and then a treat put on the dog's nose. So the poor dog is salivating and desperately wants the treat but can't open its mouth. Meanwhile, the audience is laughing and finding it extremely funny. These are on YouTube if you're interested in finding them. The way people think about and treat animals shows their regard for all living things, including other people.

I do not think that Japan is an extremely cruel country but she has her own social code which may be quite different from our sort of social code.

 

[COUNTESS]

All social codes are different, but those of countries like Japan and Saudi Arabia show extreme distain for woman and those with differences in many ways. Yes, how you treat animals, is relective on how you treat huiman beings, too.

 

[Charlotte1]

Thank you for your kind reply. Well, according to 宮内庁 (kunai cho), Masako's correct title is 皇太子徳仁親王妃雅子 (Kotaishi naruhito shinnohi masako) that, I thought, it was correct to refer her as the Princess Naruhito.

Yes, I should have said that the prince had "written" rather than "said". I understand that it was 読売新聞 (yomiuri shinbun) which reported about 寬仁親王's (Tomohito Sinno) comment re: 側室 (soku****su) but am I correct ?


Whatever it is, the prince is against 女系天皇 (nyokei tenno). Am I correct ?

I also understand that the prince had referred the Japanese nationals as "民草 (tamikusa)" in the past and this offended some Japanese people.

I was also under the impression that the tradition of 側室 (soku****su) was discontinued during the reign of the Emperor Taisho.

Regarding Masako, I am under the impression that she is suffering from 適応障害 (tekio shogai) but the general public of Japan are not so sympathetic because of the reasons that you have mentioned. This leads me to wonder if the Japanese general public are not aware of the importance of the mental health issues. Here in the West, though there are some prejudices, we have become very much aware of such issues as the mental health problems. When the fact that the Princess Victoria was suffering from anorexia was established, people in general were very sympathetic towards her. It was the same when the Duchess of Kent's depression was reported, people were more understanding of her situation.

On the Kunaicho English site Masako is referred to as the Crown Princess, unlike the other wives who have their husband's names eg Prince and Princess Akishino, Prince and Princess Hitachi. When looking at TV broadcasts of Masako, she is always refered to as "Masako-sama", Aiko is always "Aiko-sama". Their names are also written this way in the news reports. Masako upon marrying Naruhito, is now of the House of Naruhito is what an English translation could be. Naruhito is his adult name given for him to establish his own house or line. His childhood name was Prince Hiro. That's where the official title in Japanese with the Naruhito comes in with Masako, but she is not Princess Naruhito.

The Yomiuri shimbun is a tabloid, it writes symplistic stories in a tabloid form. So not a great resource for accurate information, Prince Tomohito wrote his opinion in a newsletter for one of his patronages, the Yomiuri Shinbun it seems wrote their interpretation of what he wrote. I've seen the original from the newsletter and therefore the whole text of what he wrote. No he didn't agree with a female succession, his preferred method of solving the problem of no male heirs (before Hisahito's birth) was to reinstate the noble families who lost their nobility status after WW2. The succession would go sideways to a male heir.

Using a substitute (concubine sounds demeaning to me!), to father a male child was last used by the Emperor Meiji. The Emperor Taisho was the son of Emperor Meiji and the Empress's ladyinwaiting. Taisho fathered 4 sons, so no need for substitutes and Hirohito refused. Using a substitute is something that hasn't been done is the Japanese Imperial Court for well over 100 years.

The IHA press office eventually made a statement that Masako suffered from 'adjustment disorder' something normally suffered by children who live outside of Japan for a number of years and have problems when they come back to Japan. From what the press office has stated, Masako has (is?) receiving counselling and has (is?) on medication. Mental health issues are not something that are readily discussed in Japan. But the main lack of sympathy for Masako is Japan now is mainly that she's not carrying out a full workload. It's been too many years as far as mental health issues are concerned, as Aiko is having problems at school, it's Masako who takes her to school each day and sits in the class with her. If Masako is well enough to spend days at school, then she's well enough to carry out more engagements is the view.

I understand that it was after Masako's miscarriage when some Japanese people started becoming more hostile towards her. Some people blamed her for losing the Crown Prince's (東宮さまTogusama) child and when she gave a birth to a girl, they became more aggressive in their tactics in condemning her and now some malcontent elements in the Japanese society are saying that Masako is a spy from the Sokagakkai (創価学会) sent into the imperial family in order to destroy the imperial lineage (皇統koto) etc..

The idea that some Japanese people were hostile to Masako after her miscarriage is not accurate. I was living in Japan at the time, with the annoucement she was 'showing signs of pregnancy' there was enormous excitement and goodwill, with the miscarriage news there was enormous sadness and sympathy. She certainly didn't get any bad press, and pre-internet forums so no condemnation then.
With Aiko's birth, it was more happiness that she had given birth and 'well next time it will be a boy' rather than condemnation she had a girl!
And again far right fundamentalists are a very small minority group, getting older and the numbers fewer if going by how many turn up at the Imperial Palace on the Emperor's birthday and New Year. Whatever can be found on their websites are not widespread views!

I also understood that the Empress Michiko was treated quite harshly by her mother-in-law the Empress Nagako (香淳皇后Kojun kogo) when she married to Akihito. The Princesses Takamatsu (宣仁親王妃喜久子Nobuhito shinnohi Kikuko) and Chichibu (雍仁親王妃勢津子Yasuhito shinnohi setsuko) as well as Nobuko Matsudaira (松平 信子) were also hostile to Michiko, too, because she did not come from an aristocratic/dynastic background. Having said that, I understand that the Empress Nagoko was badly treated by her mother-in-law the Empress Sadako (貞明皇后the teimei kogo) as well during the period in which she was still the crown princess consort.

I wouldn't argue that Michiko wasn't given a hard time by her motherinlaw (as are many young Japanese wives! It's the revenge of the young Japanese wife, you too can be the motherinlaw from hell!) But the other Princesses I would question. Princess Chichibu didn't even live in Tokyo in the early years of Michiko's marriage. Princess Takamatsu was quite progressive in her views and attitudes in 2002 (when she was 92 years old) she spoke out in favour of female succession. She was close to Masako and Kiko (both commoners) and bequethed her personal tiaras to them.

Empress Sadako had little to do with her daughterinlaw and after she became Empress Nagako, Sadako moved out of Tokyo to Omiya and so didn't even live in the Imperial compound where the royals live now.

The Empress Nagoka was also the first imperial consort who breast-fed her own children. She did have a wet nurse for her children but whenever it was possible she breast-fed her children.

I would question this as well. Nagako's children were taken from her as soon as they were born and raised in a separate house, with the first 2 girls she did try and spend time with them but was actively discouraged by the nursery staff. So with her other children she spent little time with them, so breast feeding was done by wet nurses. Michiko was the one who breastfed all her children (no wet nurses) and she and Akihito insisted they live and bring up their own children. (They actually weren't the first royals to do so, Prince Mikasa, Emperor Hirohito's youngest brother lived with his children, they were Imperial children but brought up by their parents and not courtiers. Using his example helped Akihito and Michiko in pushing for the right to raise their own children. With the next generation of young royals there was never any question of anyone other than their parents raising them. Once things change in the Imperial Court, there is no going back to how things were)

 

[Kasumi]

...Masako is linguistic and speaks Japanese, English and French well and has a command of some German, Spanish and Russian as well...

This is not correct. HIH the Crown Princess can't speak Russian, since she was not able to greet late President Yeltzin during his state visit to Japan.
You are quoting the Wikipedia article "Crown Princess Masako" which refers the above mentioned Ben Hill's book full of gossips and inaccuracies.
Do we really need to discuss this topic? I believe this is some kind of endless circle.

 

[iamtheoneandonly]

I've seen clips of Japanese game shoes where a dog's mouth is duct-taped shut and then a treat put on the dog's nose. So the poor dog is salivating and desperately wants the treat but can't open its mouth. Meanwhile, the audience is laughing and finding it extremely funny. These are on YouTube if you're interested in finding them. The way people think about and treat animals shows their regard for all living things, including other people.

This sounds so awful. I have not seen this but I do not like the sound of it at all. However, not advocating the Japanese and I suppose it's none of my business since I am not Japanese, but, in Spain too, people treat animals in such ways as in the manner of bull fighting and this weird Easter custom in which they put live pigeons in clay pots and smash them by throwing stones at them. In the UK, until recently, certain people were enjoying fox hunting. The way in which they were hunting the poor fox was so cruel. That many dogs jumping on a poor fox and tear its body into pieces and they called that a recreation. I remember, when the ban was brought into, reading an article of the Dowager Duchess of Devonshire saying that she would carry on hunting and would get arrested for it. She is a lovely lady but I thought she lost it. Oh, there are still some people who use dogs to hunt badgers in the same way. In Greece, Russia, Turkey etc people put a defenceless bear on a burning stake and call that a dancing bear. In Australia, some farmers kill kangaroos and their babies in such cruel ways, too. Oh, some Danish fishermen also slaughtered some dolphins in a brutal fashion which some fishermen in Japan do regularly. And, in Turkey, Romania etc, they put children and people who are mentally disabled in such inhumane conditions. Then, they still think they can join the EU. Oh, not forgetting the human trafficking of women and children from the former communist block. They are shipped around to other countries just like animals.

Anyway, going back to Masako, yes, she is treated unfairly and had she been married to a Danish prince, a Dutch prince or a Swedish prince or whoever, her situation would have been more different.

 

[iamtheoneandonly]

All social codes are different, but those of countries like Japan and Saudi Arabia show extreme distain for woman and those with differences in many ways. Yes, how you treat animals, is relective on how you treat huiman beings, too.

Well, I do not think that Japan and Saudi Arabia are the same regarding how they treat women. I have lived in Tokyo for a while once but I do not remember women being treated in such degrading ways like in the Arab world. I found the Japanese women in general quite westernised and liberal in many ways. I was quite surprised to see how much they were enjoying going out until the early hours of the morning. In my opinion, some British women are more restricted because they are women (for instance, certain clubs do not allow women's entry etc). I came across some American men who were so male chauvinist and treated their women inferior to them whereas in Scandinavia women in general are more progressive.

Anyway, going back to the subject of Masako, I do think that the female members of the imperial family are more disadvantaged than the male members of their family which may be not so dissimilar to the status of some women in some parts of Switzerland where women are not allowed to vote. I do think it is rather strange when their society has this strange custom of "muko yoshi" in which the heiress of the family takes up her husband and succeeds as the head of her family and her husband changes his surname to that of his wife.

 

[iamtheoneandonly]

This is not correct. HIH the Crown Princess can't speak Russian, since she was not able to greet late President Yeltzin during his state visit to Japan.
You are quoting the Wikipedia article "Crown Princess Masako" which refers the above mentioned Ben Hill's book full of gossips and inaccuracies.
Do we really need to discuss this topic? I believe this is some kind of endless circle.

This is not correct. HIH the Crown Princess can't speak Russian, since she was not able to greet late President Yeltzin during his state visit to Japan.
You are quoting the Wikipedia article "Crown Princess Masako" which refers the above mentioned Ben Hill's book full of gossips and inaccuracies.

Well, I do read the wikipedia but I, who does not speak French, too, can speak a bit of French if the need must be when I am in France. I think some people are sort of quite linguistic by nature and I think that Masako, too, is like that. Besides, she did live in the USSR as a child. I do not say that I speak Russian but even I know few words in Russian, too, to greet to my Russian guests. Anyway, I understand that Masako takes a great interest in the art of Russian icons. And .., one never knows if she learned a bit of Russian after Yeltzin's visit before meeting with Putin.

Do we really need to discuss this topic? I believe this is some kind of endless circle. No. However, it was not me who started this topic but 4Pam.

 

[iamtheoneandonly]

It's a novel that is supposed to be a veiled biography of either Masako or the current Empress. I can't remember which. Perhaps it's discussed under the Royal Books section.

Oh, I see. Well, it sounds as if this book is full of rubbish about Masako or Michiko or whoever that no point for me to read it.

Thank you anyway for this info.

 

[iamtheoneandonly]

To Charlotte1

Yes, it seems as if the Japanese media often call the Crown Princess consort Masako sama (雅子さま) and her daughter Aiko as Aiko sama (愛子さま). I think this is quite unusual because when Akihito and Michiko were the Crown Prince and the Crown Princess consort, their children were called by their go sho go 御称号 (or titles).Hiro no miya sama 浩宮さま Aya no miya sama 礼宮さま and Nori no miya sama 紀宮さま. Had this custom been carried out still today, Aiko would have been referred to as Toshi no miya sama 敬宮さま, I think.

Well, as far as I am aware, Naruhito is his given name and his gosho go was Hiro no miya (his grandfather Hirohito named him Hiro no miya Naruhito 浩宮徳仁). Because he is the Crown Prince, he does not have his miya go 宮号 but his younger brother Fumihito has his own miya go which is Akishino 秋篠. Michiko when she was still the Crown Princess consort, she created a rule book re: how to see to Prince Naruhito for her household staff. The media called this rule book "Naru chan Kempo" or Naru's National Constitution, as I remember.

His childhood name was Prince Hiro. That's where the official title in Japanese with the Naruhito comes in with Masako, but she is not Princess Naruhito. Oh, I see. However, in Japanese, her real style is Kotaishi Naruhito shinno hi Masako 皇太子徳仁親王妃雅子 or a direct translation will be something like the Crown Prince Prince Imperial Naruhito's imperial or royal consort Masako. Because she was not born as a naishinno 内親王 or a joo 女王, according to Kunai cho, it is wrong to call her Princess Masako or whatever.

You say that the Yomiuri shimbun is a tabloid, it writes symplistic stories in a tabloid form. That is not good, is it ?

Prince Tomohito wrote his opinion in a newsletter for one of his patronages which was 柏朋会 Hakuhokai's newsletter ざ・とど Za Todo, so I understand.

Well, it seems as though it is not so clear regarding his opinion of josei tenno 女性天皇 but I do understand that he is against jokei tenno 女系天皇. Oh, if I may say so, it is not the nobility whom he thought about to be reinstated but the male members of the former imperial cadet houses (kyu kozoku 旧皇族) to be reinstated. The old nobility (kyu kazoku 旧華族) of Japan do not belong to koto 皇統 (the imperial lineage) that they are not entitled to succeed the throne. Otherwise, the long line of the current imperial house will be discontinued according to the prince's understanding. There were 11 miya ke 宮家 (imperial cadet houses) who were instructed to leave their imperial highness status after the WWII. Asaka no miya, Kaya no miya, Kuni no miya etc houses had to give up their membership of the kozoku 皇族.

Using a substitute (concubine sounds demeaning to me!) Well, the upper class concubines in Japan were called soku****su 側室 and otherwise mekake 妾. Yes, Mutsuhito had a lot of soku****sus.

Yes, Naruko Yanagiwara (aka Nii no tsubone) was the Emperor Taisho's natural mother. Naruko's brother was Count Yanagiwara.

Yes, the Emperor Showa was quite adamant about this and he told his advisers that "Watashi wa Naga miya de yoi." (Nagako alone is enough for me) or something.

The IHA press office eventually made a statement that Masako suffered from 'adjustment disorder' something normally suffered by children who live outside of Japan for a number of years and have problems when they come back to Japan. To me, it sounds as if she is suffering from a combination of depression and anxiety disorder. I do understand that Masako has been treated professionally for a good while.

You say that the mental health issues are not something that are readily discussed in Japan. I reckon that the Japanese are still a bit backward when it comes to this sort of topic.

But the main lack of sympathy for Masako is Japan now is mainly that she's not carrying out a full workload. Well, the Duchess of Kent has not been doing anything "royal" for a lot longer than Masako because of her physical/mental health problems. She was teaching music to some under privileged children or something. It's been too many years as far as mental health issues are concerned, Well, this sort of mental health problem just goes on and on, so I understand.

You talk about the fact that Masako takes Aiko to school everyday is something not so good but don't most mothers/fathers take their children to school ? Otherwise, how do they get to school ? I used to have a Spanish friend who went to the same school as Don Felipe of Spain. She used to tell me that the Queen Sofia used to bring Felipe to school in her own car everyday. and sits in the class with her. Oh, that is not good. I wonder why ? If Masako is well enough to spend days at school, then she's well enough to carry out more engagements is the view. Well, I do not see that at all. I do not think that it is good for a child to have his/her parent sitting with them in his/her class everyday (though we can occasioanlly help their classes as a volunteer) but this is the very nature of the mental health problems. They may be fine within their comfort zone or within their private capacity but when they are brought into the public arena, they can develop such awful panic attacks and anxiety problems.Again, it seems to show the Japanese people's lack of understanding regarding the mental health issues. I read in a health care related book that one in four people now have some degree of mental health problems.

Re: her miscarriage, well, the general public was more sympathetic about all her miscarriage, so I understand, but the far right had already started making some noises, so I understood then when I was chatting with some Japanese people. Around at that time of Aiko's birth, I did hear from some Japanese ladies that there was so much pressue put upon Masako to produce a male heir. They were saying, "kawaiso."

Well, it is good to know that the extreme right wing people are minority in Japan. However, I do understand that there is a streak of xenophobia/jingoism growing in Japan of late. The Yunohana Onsen incident was one example of this latest trend, I hear. And .., people who are associated with the extreme right wing movement are often anti-Masako as well, so they say.

Well, I understand that Nagako, Setsuko, Kikuko as well as Yanagiwara Byakuren who caused a scandal when she was young were verbally, via certain channels such as Tokiwa kai etc, hostile to Michiko.

Princess Takamatsu was quite progressive in her views and attitudes in 2002 (when she was 92 years old) she spoke out in favour of female succession. Yes, I heard that she was pro-josei tenno but did not express her thought upon the jokei tenno.

I understand that the Princess Chichibu was particularly fond of Kiko because her ancestor was a shizoku from the Aizu han and the Princess Chichibu's grandfather was the last daimyo of Aizu or something.

I understand that before the WWII ended, the Empress Dowager moved to a goyotei (imperial villa) in Shizuoka and passed away at the Omiya gosho 大宮御所, Akasaka Goyochi 赤坂御用地, Minato ku (Omiya sama 大宮さま means Big Shrine sama which refers to an empress dowager that Omiya gosho means the empress dowager's palace). Well, I understand that the Empress Sadako's chief lady-in-waiting Tsuneko Takeya and the Empress Nagako's chief lady-in-waiting ****oko Takeya were sisters. They recalled that they found it awkward to be between the Empress Sadako and the Empress Nagako because it was their duties to relay the Empress Sadako's displeasure about the Crown Princess consort to the Crown Princess consort Nagako herself or whatever.

Oh, Nagoko's Omiya gosho was the Fukiage gosho 吹上御所 in the Fukiage gyoen 吹上御苑 (the old Fukiage no oniwa 吹上の御庭 of the Edo Castle) within the Kokyo 皇居 (the Imperial Palace).

Well, I do understand that Nagako did breast-feed her children. Yes, there was an Ochinohito or Menoto (wet nurse) but as much as it was possible, she tried to breast-feed her children, so I understand. Hirohito and Nagako's first child the Teru no miya Shigeko naishinno and her sister were not sent out to another family to be looked after but were looked after at home which was regarded as something new to the Imperial Family and the upper nobility of Japan. However, later in 1930, the Teru no miya and her sisters were moved to a building within the old honmaru of Edo Castle to be looked after by the nursery staff. Akihito was also brought up by his parents first but, when he was two years old, moved to Akasaka Palace and looked after by the nursery staff, so I understand. Yes, Michiko, too, breast-fed. Michiko also requested to have a small kitchen installed in the Crown Prince's Palace or Togu gosho so that she could cook for her husband by herself. I take it that this did not go down very well with the Empress Nagako.

Anyway, the Imperial House of Japan is an old institution and has its adaptability to survive throughout all sorts of events in the history of Japan, I am sure.

Anyway, I was chatting with a Japanese lady yesterday at a Halloween party. According to her, Masako is not particularly unpopular in Japan but the general public in Japan just think that unfortunately she is not suited to the post of the crown princess consort because she is more suited to be a diplomat or something else. She said that people in general just think that her talent is waisted. She also said that people tend to say that, in an ideal world, it is better if she and her husband with their daughter could quit the imperial family but there is no such a precedence it will be impossible for them to take up such an option. She also said that otherwise the general public were not bothered about the imperial family that much but they were more interested in the lives of the Japanese celebrities etc.. People who are into this subject are some sad people such as the extreme right and people who have nothing better to do or something.

 

[iamtheoneandonly]

I understand what you mean and I appreciate your explanation very much. And I think that the words by W. Scott Morton that you quote in your other post (“The Japanese... are a product of a history driven by two opposing forces-the relentless march of cultural change and the steadfast desire to maintain tradition. The nearly ceaseless and often violent conflict between these forces has made the story of Japan’s traditional past a pageant unrivaled in the sweep of its human drama”.) are, indeed, very much to the purpose.

But, I must say, if it is their idea of harmony to radically destroy everything that does not fit into their preconceived pattern I certainly don´t share it. And although I am, of course, not qualified to say anything about the deeper meaning of “ai” (which, I suppose, would be “harmony” in Japanese) at least the European word “harmony” would agree with me. “Harmonia” is the daughter of the Greek goddess of love, Aphrodite, and the Greek god of war, Ares. So, harmony is created by the loving union of two adversary powers, not by the elimination of one of them. And you cannot “make” or “produce” it, you can only let it grow (or not).

"ai 愛" is "love" and "wa 和" as in 昭和 (showa) is "harmoney".

 

[Mermaid1962]

People who've known the situations that Imperial wives have lived in have said that it's quite true to an actual biography. So I don't think that it's necessarily "rubbish." It's quite sympathetic to the woman who married into the Imperial Family.

Oh, I see. Well, it sounds as if this book is full of rubbish about Masako or Michiko or whoever that no point for me to read it.

Thank you anyway for this info.

 

[iamtheoneandonly]

People who've known the situations that Imperial wives have lived in have said that it's quite true to an actual biography. So I don't think that it's necessarily "rubbish." It's quite sympathetic to the woman who married into the Imperial Family.

Oh, OK. Well, I do not know what to believe. Kasumi says that this Ben Hill's book is "full of gossips and inaccuracies."

 

[iamtheoneandonly]

I'm not sure if this is the wright thread for my question.
Does anyone know any details about CPss Masako's sisters Mrs Shibuya and Mrs Ikeda current life events? Do they have any children of their own, Masako's nephews?

And French Wikipedia refers the writer Jun Etou to be Masako's uncle
Jun Etō - Wikipédia
They say he has commited suiside in 1999. What a tragedy for the whole family...
Sorry for my clumsy English! I'd like to get some information about Masako's relatives.

Well, I am not sure about the accuracy of the information below but here we are.


Reiko Ikeda 池田 礼子 (8 July 1966, Geneva)


1973 April Baptised according to the rite of the Roman Catholic Church
(baptismal name, Madelainne)
1988 March Graduated from the Keio University (law BA)
1991 August Graduated from the University of Geneva (law MA)
1991 September Office of the United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees
2000 October Married to Masahisa Ikeda in New York


Currently she is a mother of two children


Setsuko Shibuya 渋谷節子 (8 July 1966, Geneva)


1973 April Baptised according to the rite of the Roman Catholic Church
(baptismal name Marie)

Her late maternal grandfather was Yutaka Egashira, the head of the controversial Chisso Corporation which caused the Minamata Disease. The right wing people seem to focus on this Masako's connection with the company and asking her to appologise to the victims of the Minamata disease on behalf of her late maternal grandfather or whatever. They also point out the fact that Masako did not attend the Empress Nagako's funeral but did attend her controversial maternal grandfather's funeral etc according to what I have read. Aren't they petty ?

 

[iamtheoneandonly]

I'm not sure if this is the wright thread for my question.
Does anyone know any details about CPss Masako's sisters Mrs Shibuya and Mrs Ikeda current life events? Do they have any children of their own, Masako's nephews?

And French Wikipedia refers the writer Jun Etou to be Masako's uncle
Jun Etō - Wikipédia
They say he has commited suiside in 1999. What a tragedy for the whole family...
Sorry for my clumsy English! I'd like to get some information about Masako's relatives.

Well, it seems as if it is true that Masako's relative Jun Eto whose real name was Atsuo Egashira committed suicide in 1999. Eto was born on 25 December 1932 and died on 21 July 1999 at the age of 66 shortly after his wife's death. He himself was suffering from some trauma after having had a stroke. He, apparently, slashed his wrist in his home bathroom in Kamakura and died.

Anyway, he was a nephew of Masako's maternal grandfather Yutaka Egashira. (Eto's father Takashi Egashira was a younger brother of Yutaka Egashira.) He was a literacy critique and a doctor of letters worked as a lecturer at the Keio University. He was well known for his research work in Kaishu Katsu and Soseki Natsume.

Initially he was a left wing but later became a right wing in politics and social issues.

 

[Esmerelda]

...1973 April Baptised according to the rite of the Roman Catholic Church
(baptismal name Marie)

Masako's family were Catholic? I find that a bit surprising. Did Masako have to give up her religion to marry Naruhito?

 

[iamtheoneandonly]

...I believe that the Japanese is the only nation that has turned cruelty into the form of art (e.g., seppuku).

"Seppuku" was only allowed for the upper stratum of the samurai class such as the daimyos. Certainly the aristocracy in Kyoto (kuge公家) and the members of the imperial family did not have this tradition. In fact, the Chotei 朝廷 or the Imperial Court and its kuge 公家 class looked down on the samurai class because of their military nature. Neither the commoners (the farmer class or no農, the artisan class or ko工, the merchant class or sho商 and the untouchable or eta穢多 and hinin非人) were allowed to use this method of the death penalty.

The European world, too, had such cruel methods of capital punishment in the form of "hanged, drawn and quartered".

Japan also has this strange custom called muko yoshi 婿養子/muko tori kon 婿取婚 in which system a man marries his wife and takes up her surname. In this case, his wife's possition is superior to that of her husband.

Another thing is that it seems to be quite normal in Japan for wives to be in charge of their family money. Their husbands leave the domestic financial affairs entirely to their wives and beg their wives for their pocket money.

It's a very weird country, well, to me, anyway, but the latter bit is particularly very good indeed.

 

[iamtheoneandonly]

Masako's family were Catholic? I find that a bit surprising. Did Masako have to give up her religion to marry Naruhito?

Well, I do not know if Masako is/was a Roman Catholic or not. When the Crown Prince Akihito and Michiko Shoda got married, the Japanese media was speculating about Michiko's religious status because her grandfather Teiichiro Shoda was a Roman Catholic and so was her father Hidesaburo Shoda. However at that time the Japanese nation were told by the Kunai cho that Michiko had never been baptised. You know, the former Prime Minister of Japan Taro Aso is a Roman Catholic and the House of Aso is a Roman Catholic family. Well, Taro Aso's younger sister Nobuko (neé Aso) is married to the Prince Tomohito (who is the eldest son of the Prince Mikasa) but when they got married the media did not talk about Nobuko's religious background.

I also remember reading in one of Roman Catholic newspapers that, when Hirohito passed away and Akihito became the tenno, Michiko took a couple of RC women as her ladies-in-waiting. Oh, I just remembered that Yasuhiko Asaka (formerly 朝香宮鳩彦王 Asaka no miya Yasuhiko o or Prince Yasuhiko the Prince of Asaka) who was one of the members of the 11 imperial princely cadet houses 宮家 miya ke had to become plain Mr Yasuhiko Asaka in 1947 convereted into the Roman Catholic faith after the WWII.

I do not know why the Kunai cho is so hush hush about this sort of matter. Prince Henrik was Roman Catholic prior to getting married to the Queen Margrethe II and so was their son Joachin's wife Marie. Arexandra was an Anglican before she got married to Joachim. Henrik received a permission from the pope and Marie, too, got a permission and converted to the Lutheran faith. Alexandra, too, became Lutheran before her wedding. Princess Michael Kent did not convert to the Anglican faith when she was getting married to Prince Michael Kent that the prince lost his right of succession to the throne of the United Kingdom.

When you think about it, apart from the Princess Nagako (Nagako joo 良子女王), a daughter of Prince Kuniyoshi the Prince of Kuni (Kuni no miya Kuniyoshi o 久邇宮邦彦王), none of the empress consorts were of the Shinto religion initially. the Empress Sadako was a daughter of a noble man called the Prince Kujo (not an imperial prince) and the faith of the House of Kujo was Buddhism. the Empress Haruko (the wife of the Emperor Meiji) was from the princely House of Ichijo (again, non imperial prince) whose religion was also the Buddhist faith. They all followed the Shinto tradition after having married into the imperial family. So, I do not think it is such a big deal but, I guess, that the Japanese public still regard the Christian religion somehow "foreign" when the Buddhism is also a foreign import.

 

[Kasumi]

...

iamtheoneandonly,
You make a lot of conclusions about the family situation, faith and backgrounds of the members of the Imperial family of Japan. Too many words and some Japanese kanji symbols.
Are there any links to prove your information, any reliable books or sources? Are you a close friend of the Imperial family member? Are you an Imperial palace stuff or an insider?
The provided info sounds weird to me before I shall be able to see any prooflinks.
Regards.

 

[iamtheoneandonly]

[FONT=arial, helvetica, sans-serif]Well, I do not make any conclusions re: the imperial family of Japan but just state what I have read and heard about them. I studied the Japanese history as well as the language that I have a bit of insight into the history of Japan. I also lived in Tokyo and experienced the life of everyday Japanese people. I still have some contacts with some Japanese people and luckily I have few Japanese friends here, too, that I can ask them few questions about Masako saga etc..[/FONT]

[FONT=arial, helvetica, sans-serif]Is this OK with you ?[/FONT]

[FONT=arial, helvetica, sans-serif]素顔の雅子さま 主婦と生活社[/FONT]
[FONT=arial, helvetica, sans-serif]母宮貞明皇后とその時代　三笠宮両殿下が語る思い出[/FONT]
[FONT=arial, helvetica, sans-serif]貞明皇后[/FONT]
[FONT=arial, helvetica, sans-serif]四代の天皇と女性たち[/FONT]
[FONT=arial, helvetica, sans-serif]陛下お尋ね申し上げます[/FONT]
[FONT=arial, helvetica, sans-serif]入江相政日記[/FONT]
[FONT=arial, helvetica, sans-serif]天皇家の戦い[/FONT]
[FONT=arial, helvetica, sans-serif]天皇[/FONT]
[FONT=arial, helvetica, sans-serif]朝日新聞「皇太后さまは権殿で拝礼へ 昭和天皇崩御から1年」[/FONT]
[FONT=arial, helvetica, sans-serif]???????[/FONT]
[FONT=arial, helvetica, sans-serif]]“¡~Fì‰ÆŽ–“TF‚Ù‚çŠL[/FONT]

and more.

 

[Kasumi]

..[FONT=arial, helvetica, sans-serif]. I have few Japanese friends here, too, that I can ask them few questions about Masako saga etc..[/FONT]

[FONT=arial, helvetica, sans-serif]Is this OK with you ?[/FONT]
...
[FONT=arial, helvetica, sans-serif]???????[/FONT]
[FONT=arial, helvetica, sans-serif]]“¡~Fì‰ÆŽ–“TF‚Ù‚çŠL[/FONT]

Thank you for your quick reply and for your commitment to 'the saga'.
Still I prefer to get acquainted with any reliable source on the matter. I mean not fictional or speculations. Any source in Japanese will do either.

 

[iamtheoneandonly]

Thank you for your quick reply and for your commitment to 'the saga'.
Still I prefer to get acquainted with any reliable source on the matter. I mean not fictional or speculations. Any source in Japanese will do either.

Can you read Japanese ? If you can, try these books. I wonder if you can get them in Ukraine .. .

素顔の雅子さま 主婦と生活社
[FONT=arial, helvetica, sans-serif]母宮貞明皇后とその時代　三笠宮両殿下が語る思い出[/FONT]
[FONT=arial, helvetica, sans-serif]貞明皇后[/FONT]
[FONT=arial, helvetica, sans-serif]四代の天皇と女性たち[/FONT]
[FONT=arial, helvetica, sans-serif]陛下お尋ね申し上げます[/FONT]
[FONT=arial, helvetica, sans-serif]入江相政日記 This one in particular is good.[/FONT]
[FONT=arial, helvetica, sans-serif]天皇家の戦い[/FONT]
[FONT=arial, helvetica, sans-serif]天皇[/FONT]

cŽº - •¶‰» - MSNŽYŒoƒjƒ…[ƒX This site has some up-to-date information re: the imperial family, too.

???

 

[Kasumi]

Thanks, I have these books in my little 'royal library' already. Not in Ukraine.
Thank you anyway.

 

[ChiaraC]

Relationship of crown couple/Prince&Princess Akishino

Lenora has asked in the „Succession Issues“-thread about

the true relationship of two daughters-in-law of the Emperor,of Princess Masako and Kiko, if they get along well.

As an answer to this is mainly based on speculation I do not think that this matter deserves a thread of its own. I´ll explain below why I decided to put it here. But if the mods should feel that this should better be somewhere else, please feel free to move it.

I remember having repeatedly read that the two princesses „do not get along well“ (if I come across it next time, I´ll post a link) but none of the authors have ever explained how they´ve come to know. (And the fact that I´ve repeatedly read it is not necessarily meaningful – maybe one copied it from the other...) Of course, the princesses are supposed to be rivals in the competition of „who produces a male heir to the Japanese throne“ (which Kiko „won“) but nobody has ever been able to ascertain if the crown princess has felt grieved or rather relieved by the fact that her sister-in-law had taken the burden off her shoulders, so to speak. As for Kiko, she may have had lots of reasons for bearing Hisahito but I doubt that the wish to spite Masako has played much of a part for her, if at all. (I suppose that she wanted to please her husband and her parents-in-law, in the first place.) It is clear though that they are not intimate friends. If they´d regularly meet, just the two of them, to have tea and chat, I am sure we´d know that. But I, for one, have never heard of an incident that proved a positive dislike between the two. The one hard fact that we do have is that their husbands did not seem the best of friends lately. This became shockingly clear to the public in 2004 when Prince Akishino criticized his elder brother for having defended his wife against the IHA. (And this is why I have put the answer to Lenora´s question into this thread: that was basically the start of criticisms of the crown prince and princess.)

You may want to take a look at this blog where Masako and Kiko are compared or at this that deals with the rift between the brothers. (In both cases, just ignore the first part that deals with the journey - unless you might happen to be interested.)

I´d like to add that I do not have the impression that the brothers have been getting along much better lately. It raised a lot of attention when Prince Akishino said last year when he turned 45 that he and his older brother had discussed the future of the royal family many times, adding ‘‘We must always think how we should exist to respond to the demands of the times.’’ So when the crown prince´s birthday arrived in February he was asked to comment. Link I will quote the question as well as the answer in full length as to give you an opportunity to take a look of your own at it.

Question 5:
You said in last year's press conference, "While learning various things from the past, I would like to pursue the ideal role of the Imperial Family in the future." His Imperial Highness Prince Akishino also stated in the press conference on the occasion of his birthday last year that you have discussed the issue with him on several occasions. Since Her Imperial Highness Crown Princess Masako has been in recuperation, Your Imperial Highness has been attending a number of official duties by yourself, including visits to local regions. Please tell us, specifically, the vision of the Imperial Family in the future that you are pursuing with His Imperial Highness Prince Akishino, including the future role of Your Imperial Highness and Her Imperial Highness the Crown Princess in the official duties.

Answer 5:
Previously, I said that as new ideas about the needs for official duties naturally emerge in accordance with the changing times, it is important to consider official duties in such a way as to respond to new social needs, in accordance with these changes. That belief has not changed. Last year, I indicated water issues, environmental issues, and affairs concerning children and the elderly as areas of interest. But I am not limiting myself to these areas. I believe there will be social needs for new official duties in other areas as well, which I would like to deal with in a sincere manner.

With Prince Akishino, there are a number of occasions where there are opportunities to discuss various issues, and I intend to do so in the future as well.

Now if one wants to gather some meaning from anything a member of the IF says in public one has to be aware that they may spend a whole press conference without saying anything that seems to be at all remarkable or original. One could even say that it is that what usually happens... And that is not because they are stupid or dull (to the contrary, IMO ) but because they are so narrowly restricted in what they might say. (As you may have read in the blog, “They cannot say they like apples, because if they did, what would the orange growers say?”)

In order to understand what they want to say, one has to be aware that there are a lot of things that they cannot say, may they ever be so true. I usually compare what they do say to what they could have said. In this case: the crown prince could never have answered (even if there should be some truth in it): „I have never had a meaningful conversation with my brother on the role of the imperial family and I do not see why I should. My brother may have reasons of his own for pretending that I did.“
What he COULD have said instead would be, for example:
- „I have had indeed various discussions on the subject with my brother and was pleased to find that our opinions have much in common.“
- „I have had indeed various discussions on the subject with my brother and found his opinions quite interesting.“
- „I have had indeed various discussions on the subject with my brother and intend to have more in the future.“
- „I have discussed various issues with my brother, among them the role of the imperial family...“
- „I have discussed various issues with my brother...“
But what he, in fact, tells us, is that there were OPPORTUNITIES to discuss various issues, and we can only gather from the „as well“ in the second part of the sentence that the brothers have, in fact, made use of these opportunities (well, once, maybe...). While the crown prince takes great pains in letting us know that the question of new official duties is an issue that he has very much at heart (he even returns to the subject later in the press conference) he obviously does his very best to keep his brother out of it. He does not even so much as confirm that the role of the imperial family has actually been amongst those „various issues“ (that could have been the wheather, the blooming of the cherry trees, the health of the family etc) that the brothers have discussed (or did not discuss but had the opportunity to do so...)

IMO, it is absolutely impossible to express a lack of enthusiasm concerning a discussion with his brother on the monarchy more clearly than the crown prince does here, without being downright impolite. And this is why I think that the brothers are, still, not the best of friends, and as loyal wives, Princesses Masako and Kiko probably support their husbands.

 

[shari-aree]

Wow.

All I can add to this is, ... that poor Woman.

She married a Man she loves; and because of his position has to put up with harsh, and cruel negativity.

It's times like these, when I read stuff like this that I "Thank the powers that be that I didn't get my Childhood wish to become a Princess"!

I wish her happiness, may she rise above all the critisism and one day find herself a respected Princess in her home country.

xoxosending her love

 

[Mirabel]

I don't believe Masako did love Naruhito when she married him, although perhaps she does love him now. He has made it clear he is absolutely devoted to her.

However, when he first proposed, she was obviously reluctant. She already had a lover, and a career she valued, and had no wish to become part of the Imperial family. I think she acquiesced more as a matter of duty, since he loved her so much that he was unwilling to accept any alternative match. JMO.

 

[ChiaraC]

I agree with you concerning her not being in love with him before they married. I mean, they had met only a few times before they got engaged! (Although I have to admit that, for him, that seems to have been quite sufficient... )

Of course, none of us are in a position to know for sure, there is a lot left to speculation concerning that matter. I have heard people say that they believe she was forced into marrying him by the pressure exerted on her family. (Not a good reputation indeed of being the family of the young lady who turned down the crown prince...) I, in contrast, think that before the wedding she liked him and respected him and that she had already made the experience that they really enjoyed talking together, about any- and everything. (Something that she mentioned later in a press conference as one of the highlights of their relationship.) But what won her over at last was IMO the prince succeeding in convincing her that she would be able to use her professional diplomatic skills as crown princess and in this way serve her country even more effectively. Well...
(I suppose it COULD have worked if only she had gotten pregnant in the first years of their marriage...In fact, it did work during the first 1 ½ years. Basically until the Kobe earthquake.)

But on a lighter note, I do have the impression that Princess Masako loves her husband by now. I always like to see how they smile at each other.
Here is a very nice collage of pics, mainly showing the Crown Prince and Princess together at various times.

 

[XeniaCasaraghi]

The way things have gone have led me to believe that the Prince marrying Masako was a disaster. I feel sorry for all involved.

 

[Mermaid1962]

I think that we'll have to wait and see what happens when the current Emperor dies to see whether it's a disaster or not.

The way things have gone have led me to believe that the Prince marrying Masako was a disaster. I feel sorry for all involved.

 

[Zonk]

Usually I would agree with you but I think we can see the writing on the wall with this one.

If the Emperor dies, I think we will see more of a pull between the Crown Prince and the IHA and Masako being one in the middle AGAIN. She is his weakness (based on his love and devotion to her). If they want to get to him, all they have to do is more of the same.

Considering how the Empress was treated by the IHA and her mother in law, I am really surprised that the Emperor has saw on the side lines while pretty much let the same thing being done to Masako. Which goes to show IMO how much power the IHA has.