Bowing and Curtseying


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Catherine Helvin said:
I think it was either Queen Elizabeth or King George VI who did away with the practice of monarchs having to be bowed/curtseyed to by their children. However, a King or Queen is of higher rank than a Prince or Princess so Princess Diana curtseyed to King Juan Carlos of Spain.
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Not entirely true, I don't believe. I was watching video of Princess Anne's wedding, and as her and Capt. Philips were leaving the Abbey, she curtsied to her mother. Andrew bowed to his mother after his wedding with Sarah Ferguson.

At official events like that, I believe they do bow/curtsy, but I don't think they'd do it she just walked into a room at the family home.
 
It's tradition that the new married couple bow to the present Queen and/or King (Duke of Edinburgh/Prince Henrik).
Prince Charles and Camilla did it to Queen Elizabeth and Prince Phillip in 2005.
Prince Frederik & Princess Mary, Prince Joachim & Princess Marie did it to Queen Margrethe and Prince Henrik at there respective weddings.
At official events, like Sister Morphine says, they probably will curtsey/bow but not everday.
 
I have to make some pertinent corrections to the above concerning British court protocol. All princes and princesses of the blood and their spouses bow or curtsey to the soverign; a prince or princess does not bow to Prince Philip - he is not a constitutional prince consort. Although the current royal family and a few remaining families adhere to the tradition of kissing (something the late Queen Mother didn't like, but then she was from a landed coal owning aristocratic and not a royal background) the hand of a lady of rank, kissing her left cheek if a close friend, and kissing both cheeks if a kinswoman; doing all three if she is a close kinswoman of high rank. The misplaced political correctness of the established elite thinks it fine not to bow or curtsey. Quaint custom? Next week a new Prime Minister will be appointed by the Queen and believe me if he were not to kiss hands then that would be a constitutional crisis. Perhaps those seeking power have always been prepared to bow the knee!
 
Hereditary Thane said:
I have to make some pertinent corrections to the above concerning British court protocol. All princes and princesses of the blood and their spouses bow or curtsey to the soverign; a prince or princess does not bow to Prince Philip - he is not a constitutional prince consort.
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He's a prince of the blood by birth. Doesn't that imply a position of respect?
 
^^
But you don't have to curtsey to someone with the same title as you, no?
 
Melibea said:
^^
But you don't have to curtsey to someone with the same title as you, no?
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No, to my knowledge you don't. However Philip is the consort to the Queen, not just any Prince. So I wouldn't expect CP Haakon to bow to CP Frederik, but I would think he would to Frederik's father, the consort of the Queen of Denmark.


I hope that makes sense.
 
Surely, apart from the straight protocol-rules, there are non-official rules too?
I cannot imagine CPs' Frederic of Haakon NOT making a (small) bow to eg. prince Charles.
And if some some horrible reason CP Victoria became Queen tomorrow, she would still curtsey to Queen Elizabeth.
Age and respect for a person, surely influences these rules too.

Any ideas about that? :)
 
^^
I forgot to say to the BRF :)

It was an answer the post before mine, I know that they are considered the most important royal family but I doubt that a king/queen will curtsey to the british queen. But if someone with more knowledge can answer I will appreciate it
 
Well, I used the BRF as an example because it shows the age-difference really well.
I indeed do not think that the other Kings/Queens bow to QEII. But I think that a 'new' and much younger K/Q, might.
 
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Royalty of the same status tend not to bow to each other.
But yes, it seems sensible that a younger King/Queen should bow to an older King/Queen.

Prince Phillip is a Prince by birth, albeit of Greece and Denmark, but he is still a Prince. He deserves to be bowed to by anyone below him. He is the Prince Consort, in everything but name.
 
Melibea said:
^^
I forgot to say to the BRF :)

It was an answer the post before mine, I know that they are considered the most important royal family but I doubt that a king/queen will curtsey to the british queen. But if someone with more knowledge can answer I will appreciate it
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The British Royal Family is no more important in the grand scheme of things than the royal families from any other country. Heads of state do not bow/curtsy to other heads of state. So Queen Margrethe would not curtsy to Queen Elizabeth and when CP Haakon becomes King, he would not bow to CP Frederik when he is King. Consorts fall under the same rule. So Mette-Marit when she is queen, would not curtsy to Mary.

Queen Elizabeth II is not this supreme ruler that all other Kings/Queens/Princes/Princesses must show deference to, at all times. If you are a lower rank than her, you curtsy/bow. If you are of equal rank, you do not.
 
^^
I thought that too. That's why I said that I did't think that they would curtsey to them. IMO the BRF is considered the most prestigious of all of the RF. But they don't curstsey to them if they have the same title.

But thanks anyway for the info :)
 
Just out of curiousity, why do you think the BRF is the most prestigious?
 
Well I think it's an historical thing, not that they are perfect or anything like that. IMO they were the last RF that had a lot of power in the world so some of that still remains.
 
This idea of half bows: what you are witnessing is mere acknowledgement. I have never witnessed a royal prince or princess bowing or curtsying to Prince Philip (only a prince of Great Britain since the late 1950s) though I would personally ackonwledge him with a head bow. Bowing from the waist is a Continetal practice, frowned upon at the British court. Fashion and protocol change - the Stuart sovereigns regularly bowed to their greater subjects. As long as one is sincere and respectful then it shouldn't matter if one bows or not.
 
I LOVED THE PICTURE OF PRINCESS METTE MARIT CURTSEYING TO THE QUEEN IN HER WEDDING DAY, DOES ANYONE OF YOU KNOW WHERE I CAN SEE THE VIDEO OF THE WEDDING, MORE EXACTLY THE MOMENT OF THE CURTSY, CUZ I'VE BEEN LOOKING FOR IT EVERYWHERE AND I CAN´T FIND IT!!! I WOULD REALLY APPRECIATE IT!

HERE IT'S A VIDEO OF THE 60 ANNIVERSARY OF THE CORONATION IN THAILAND, AT 0:47 YOU CAN SEE PRINCESS METTE MARIT CURTSEYING TO THE QUEEN AND KING.

YouTube - ROYAL GRANDEUR ON THE RIVER 02
 
Felipe and Letizia hosted a dinner held in honour of the Heads of State and Government participating in the EU-Latin Amerian Summit, at the Royal Palace.
Letizia greeted by President of Peru, Alan García
BelgaPicture
 
I think what is happening in this discussion is that we are confusing good manners with court protocols. A nod of acknowledgement (of friendship or kinship) has nothing to do with state protocols. All heads of state are theoretically equall, but it would be very bad form for a former monarch to bow to say Queen Elizabeth II. Michael of Rumania is an annointed king and though an ex-sovereign, when he greets his cousin Elizabeth of Great Britain it is with a hand kiss (and a cheek peck as cousins too) not a bow.
 
Whats all the fuss about having to bow and curtsey. I work in a formal titled household and its a house-rule that I along with the other domestic curtsey before our prinsiples, thats the way it was and has continued to this day. For me and many other maids in my situation it just comes second nature and is not such a big deal, so of course it should be expected that lessers should bow and curtsey to royalty, its just showing respect to ones title and position...
 
Melibea said:
Well I think it's an historical thing, not that they are perfect or anything like that. IMO they were the last RF that had a lot of power in the world so some of that still remains.
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If you argue with power that Dutch RF also had a lot of power and as did Spanish RF (in history) as did Danish RF.Not to mention the Habsburgs. And when you think about it Danish RF is the oldest one historically. Wouldn't that be prestigious?
Besides about equality of Heads of State:
When edward, PoW was asked about whejer the king of Hawaii should next to him, he replied: If he is a King, of course he has to sit next to me! And if he is not, what is the bloody man doing here?
I hope it clearifies the situation with the whole prestige issue.
:flowers:
 
:previous:

In my post I said that they are the last ones who had real power and are still reigning, the ones you mentioned didn't have as much power as the BRF or right now don't reign; or in the case of the Spanish royal family firstly when they did have real power was 500 years ago and they were expulsed from Spain twice in those 500 years. And moreover they have the black legend so imo you can't compare them with the BRF.

The perception of the puclic most times don't have anything to do with real data so imo BRF is considered as the most important, in general the people doesn't know anything about the rest of the monarchies unless they have one themselves. Right now EII is the most known royal, no one will tell you anything about MII unless they are danish of course. ;)

But as I said in some posts before a king/queen should not bow to EII as they have the same title unless they want to do a small gesture in respect to her age.
 
What I wonder: When we meet ( by 'meet' I mean shake the hand when we visit a place were a royal is to give a present) and shake the hand of a royal do we have to make a révérence ? Because sometimes I see people (women) when they meet a royal bow a little ( just a littli bit, it's not to compare with how men bow to royals).
 
I don't know about the bowing thing. This is 2010. Yes the royals deserve respect, but do they really deserve all this curtseying and bowing? I don't think I would do it. A nod would do just as well.
 
I love all the bowing and curtsying. I think its good fun and respectful. Then again if I saw Harry at a grocery store I wouldn't bow but If I met the Queen somewhere I sure as heck would. I have never seen this pic before, Camilla is curtsying to H.I.M. The Empress of Japan.
 
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