Auction of the Estate of the late Count and Countess of Paris, 2008 / 2015

[maria-olivia]

The very last Orleans auction will take place at Christies -Paris on October 14th. 483 Items belonging to the late "Madame le Comtesse de Paris "will be sold by her Children hoping that Museums of France or one of the Comtesse heir's will buy them

Madame had 11 children
Isabelle, Henri Count of Paris, Hélène , François (+)
Anne , Diane ,Jacques Duc d' Orleans , Michel Count d'Evreux
Claude, Chantal, Thibault Count de la Marche (+)
She lost two of her sons

The famous painting representing SAR Madame la Comtesse de Paris by Vidal-Quadras in 1956 will be sold also.
At this Christie's Auction the last item will be a pocket-handkerchief belonging to Queen Marie-Antoinette when she was a Prisoner at the Temple (1793) .
They hope to have 12.000 -15.000 euros. How sad..

 

[maria-olivia]

I am sad that the Royal Forums have no interest at all about the French Royals of the Past.
Next week all what belonged to the Late Count et Countess of Paris , as well historical souvenirs belonging to Queen Marie-Antoinette will be sold by the Princes and Princesses of France at Christie's Paris on 14th Oktober at 11 am and 2 pm.
An exhibition will take place this coming Week-end.

 

[HRH Kerry]

No interest?

maria-olivia,
Please give our members a chance to manuever around TRF to view your posts in this thread. It could be that this thread could generate more posts once the auction gets underway. Some might want to do a little research on the countess before contributing here.

I am sad that the Royal Forums have no interest at all about the French Royals of the Past...

To say that is really moot since much of this sub-forum wouldn't exist. Just hang in there.

 

[Menarue]

I remember the French royal family here in Portugal well. I had never seen so many beautiful little fair-haired children before, they were a "sight for sore eyes".
I am very much saddened by the selling off of this last piece of history. I think I remarked on this on another thread so it has been talked about before although I can´t remember where.
I just hope that these historical souvenirs won´t be scattered all over the world in private collections and that they will be purchased by French museums so that they can be seen by the public in France where they belong.

 

[HRH Kerry]

Are the current descendants improvished?

 

[Menarue]

Are the current descendants improvished?

From the sound of it they must be, why would they sell these things if they weren´t? Perhaps they have some crippling tax to pay, I only know I would be very reluctant to part with this kind of family inheritance.
There are so many children perhaps they can´t come to an agreement.
Let us just hope that these objects fall into the right hands.

 

[HRH Kerry]

Yes, but what is the likelihood of it being seen again? The Princely Family of Liechtenstein auctioned off a lot of heirlooms as well but they were pretty much cleaning house. Soveriegn Prince Hans Adam's family had been collecting for over 400 years. The bulk went mostly to private collectors.

 

[Menarue]

Not much hope, but there is one good thing we now know these objects exist, I had no idea about Marie Antoinette´s letter and it was nice to see the little portrait of the young Louis VIII.
I believe the French Crown jewels were sold off too, at least the ones that belonged to the Comtesse de Paris.

 

[maria-olivia]

Thanks to Kerry and Menarue for your interest.
The sad thing is that they will sold souvenirs from Queen Marie Antoinette when she was Prisoner at the Temple .. The Heirs should give these or to "La Conciergerie" in Paris or to Versailles 's Castle..
The Heirs are 10 Princes and Princesses of France.
The young Louis is Louis XVII (17).

 

[Menarue]

I read as much of the letter as I could in Point de Vue and it was very touching. Also the little dedication to his sister by Louis. These are French treasures and as such should stay in France, but when are we listened to?

 

[pamk]

As I recall, the late Comte de Paris (the present Comte's father) really wasted money.
When he died, there was little left and his children were really upset.

 

[Menarue]

Yes, I remember this, and they were upset about where the money was supposed to have gone.
Not long ago I read an account by a nephew of the Comtes de Paris and I was quite surprised by it, it said that when the children went to bed at night the one parent who always took the time to go and kiss them goodnight was the ......Comte.
Old age sometimes changes people. I had always thought of him as more distant but
whatever he was like, it is a shame that these things are being sold.

 

[Warren]

There was a vast fortune including many properties which were dissipated. I remember that Point de Vue had quite a series of articles on the Comte's former assets. What happened to them has never been satisfactorily explained. The conclusion was that the late Comte was a very bitter man who had decided in his later years to leave his family nothing, or as little as possible. He was successful in his wish. The former extensive patrimony of the Orléans dynasty has largely disappeared.

 

[pamk]

Please go to the Christies Paris website --- there you can see all of the items up for auction - all 16 pages!
Most of the items are pretty unspectacular - someone in the family liked to collect canes (walking sticks) and wax sealers (those things used with sealing wax.)
Lots of small pieces of furniture (tables, chairs, carpets, etc.)
Most of the jewelry being auctioned incorporates miniature portraits of ancestors --- I wouldn't be fond of wearing jewelry like that.
So, I can understand why the auction is being held - as the saying goes: "One man's junk is another man's treasure."
The good stuff is not being sold.

As a side note: In the later years, the Comte and Comtesse were estranged and maintained separate households.
This split also divided the adult children - some sided with their father and some with their mother.
How very sad - I hope that they all bury the hatchet one day and unite as one family again. (If they have not done so already.)

 

[Menarue]

I realise that most of the objects being sold are not very interesting but the Marie Antoinette letter and the portrait are, and these two at least should be kept in France, but I suppose (sigh) that these will bring the most money so will definitely be sold.

 

[Carminha Stalker]

I still remember the shock it was to read after the Comte de Paris´s death, how he had squandered and dissipated his family´s fortune. He seemed to be a very bitter man, especially in his last years.

 

[Stefan]

There was a vast fortune including many properties which were dissipated. I remember that Point de Vue had quite a series of articles on the Comte's former assets. What happened to them has never been satisfactorily explained. The conclusion was that the late Comte was a very bitter man who had decided in his later years to leave his family nothing, or as little as possible. He was successful in his wish. The former extensive patrimony of the Orléans dynasty has largely disappeared.

Also a number of Jewels including 2 sapphire parures one of them had belonged to Queen Marie Amelie where sold in the 1990's. They are now in the Louvre.

 

[Menarue]

Well that is good news, the best place for them.

 

[HRH Kerry]

Without a doubt my favorite piece from the auction.

 

[latin]

Where is Queen Marie-Antoniette to see how her things are sold by the heirs of Philippe Egalite'?

 

[latin]

Last treasures of the French royal family go under the hammer in Paris - Europe, World - The Independent

 

[Menarue]

Well at last it has been said. That is where the enormous fortune the Comte de Paris inherited is said to have gone. I had heard this years ago.
I saw a picture in Point de Vue of the purse and Queen Marie Antoinette did exquisite needlework. We can only hope that these things will stay in France.

 

[auntie]

Last treasures of the French royal family go under the hammer in Paris - Europe, World - The Independent

It's stories like this which make my blood boil!
The old git, (royal or not) probably was sure his mistress was in love with him! wealthy old men just cannot see how foolish they look in the eyes of the world by hooking up to younger woman.

 

[HRH Kerry]

The estimated return on all of the treasures will not even equate to 1% of the original fortune inherited by the count. How sad.

 

[maria-olivia]

In a French newspaper of to-day " Vide-grenier historique."
The Countess de Paris died 5 years ago , Why this auction now?
The answer is : it is easier for her 10 Heirs (her 9 children and her grandson Robert de la Marche, son of the late Prince Thibault) to sell all .
Afterwards they will share and will have all the same money..
They expect 3 millions euros!

 

[Menarue]

I am with you auntie

 

[Carminha Stalker]

It´s sadly true, but how silly some old men (royal or not) are because of a woman. In this case, it makes your stomach turn and your hear ache. After all , many of those objects were historical and like somebody said here: poor Marie Antoinette if she could see her stuff sold by an heir of Philippe Egalité.

 

[Odette]

It's stories like this which make my blood boil!
The old git, (royal or not) probably was sure his mistress was in love with him! wealthy old men just cannot see how foolish they look in the eyes of the world by hooking up to younger woman.

Auntie the Conte de Paris had a 30+ years relationship with the lady. He lived separated by his wife for a long long time. When he met the paramour he was not old.
His son and the current Conte did the same thing with his wife and children. The only difference was that he married her.

 

[Odette]

Well at last it has been said. That is where the enormous fortune the Comte de Paris inherited is said to have gone. I had heard this years ago.
I saw a picture in Point de Vue of the purse and Queen Marie Antoinette did exquisite needlework. We can only hope that these things will stay in France.

When the Comte was still alive the couple wanted to sell some of their property and the children went to court to stop them. There was an interview with Madame who said that they would go to court and ask their children to provide them with an income so they could pay their bills. If one imagines what was inherited, given or squandered it is a sad state of affaires. The 9 children and the grandson who inherited the estate have already kept a lot of items and property. Out of the entire lot the one that makes me the saddest is the purse Marie Antoinette embroidered.
On another note Gerstende D'Orleans the daughter in law of Madame has gone to court to force her 3 brothers to sell the castle her family owned and lived in for centuries, so she could get her share. The castle has been sold sometime ago and apparently each heir got their share.
The French friends on this thread can help us with this. I believe France has a law that property deemed to belong to France's inheritance cannot leave the country. This is how the Louvre aquired the jewels. Is this still the law? I hope so. I would really loved to see the purse in the Louvre someday.

 

[pamk]

Auntie the Conte de Paris had a 30+ years relationship with the lady. He lived separated by his wife for a long long time. When he met the paramour he was not old.
His son and the current Conte did the same thing with his wife and children. The only difference was that he married her.

How true. And the poor ex-wife, Marie-Therese Duchess of Menpensier, had to raise their kids herself - two of whom are mentally handicapped.