Royal Standards


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Royal Standards--I have a few questions regarding royal standards of members of the Royal Family that hopefully someone can answer:

  1. Do all members of the royal family have a royal standard? If not, what is the determining factor that decides whether someone gets a royal standard?
  2. Who designs royal standards? I know that they are all similar to that of The Queen's with minor differences, but who decides what those differences are? For example, why does HRH Princess Beatrice of York's royal standard have bees in the design and who decided on that design?
  3. After the birth of a new member of the royal family, how long until they receive a royal standard? When will we be seeing Prince George's royal standard?
  4. For lesser royals, for example HRH Princess Beatrice of York, does anyone know of any examples where they have actually used their royal standard?
  5. Are there laws regarding the use of royal standards by members of the royal family? For example, I know that in some other countries the use of a royal standard on an official car allows them to park anywhere, etc. What's the case with members of the royal family?
 
1. Not every royal has a royal standard. Wives of British princes are members of the family, but are not given their own royal standard. Similarly children don't have their own royal standard (or a coat of arms), they're not granted one until they turn 18. People who don't have a royal standard of their own traditionally use the Royal Standard of the United Kingdom with an ermine border. The exception is the consort of the monarch, who is granted a royal standard as well. When she was still Princess of Wales, Diana had a Personal Standard that was similar to her coat of arms; the Royal Standard impaled with the Spencer Arms, but after her divorce she adopted the Royal Standard with ermine, which is what draped her coffin.

2. I'm not sure who specifically designs the standard, but for the most part what the standards are is the traditional Royal Standard of the United Kingdom with a label to differentiate between individuals, similar to the way the royal coats of arms work. I'm not sure what the different chargers on the children of the Queen's label's smybolise, but among her grandchildren it's become a bit of a tradition that the chargers are representative of their mother's coat of arms. William and Harry each have an escallop from the Spencer arms, Beatrice has a bee (also a play on her name) and Eugenie has a thistle from the Ferguson arms.

3. George will get a coat of arms and a royal standard when he turns 18. Based on current traditions in place I would expect it to look like his father's but with acorns in place of the escallop.

4. Standards aren't typically used in a day-to-day use for individuals other than the Monarch. Her standard is flown over residences to show when she's there, it's also used on her royal vehicles. Prince Philip's standard is used on vehicles when he travel's on state visits alone. The PoW flies his standard at Clarence House when he's in residence, but other royals tend not to unless they're abroad on official visits. Personal standards are used to cover the coffins of deceased royals.

5. Standards only fly from the vehicles of the monarch and consort, although other heads of states will also fly their standard on royal vehicles when visiting.
 
What's the purpose of a standard for royals other than the monarch?
 
I would think part of it would be tradition - it's tradition for members of royalty and nobility to be identified by an arms and or standard.

Part of it too is the fact that it can provide identification of where a certain royal is living. We don't see it happening much now, but that's because many royals share official London residences (imagine how many standards would have to be flown from KP).

Standards are of course just the banner form of an individual's coat of arms, and the various arms of the royal family are designed so as to say something about the individual and their heritage.
 
It goes back to the middle ages of course when most people were illiterate so showing a coat of arms, on a shield or standard flying, or eleswhere told everyone who you were.

These days there really is no use other than to identify where a person is at a particular time e.g. if the royal standard is flying at BP then The Queen is in residence - it was a highlight of my trip to the UK in 2002 to see it actually go up on one of my walks around that area - I was staying nearby so walked around that area almost daily to get to sites to see or to get to the train.

They are also flown on cars on official excursions e.g. on the cars going to William's wedding the Duke of York's standard was flown on the front of the car with the York family and the Earl of Wessex's was on his car as well.
 
i would add that we all use a form of standard today.

The military have their colours, or flags of the regiment; Countries have flags to follow; universities and sports teams have banners; towns have symbols and mottos ( I still remember my school motto Dieu est Mon Abri); in the modern age, companies have logos.

all of this stems from the Royal Standard. A symbol to recognise and follow.
 
All of the above examples come from the middle ages and the fact that people were illiterate so used signs to say who they were - not just the monarch but pubs, institutions, nobles and most importantly the church who started using the symbol of the cross and the fish when they were being persecuted by the Romans. The Romans themselves used standards in the republican times - pre-empire - to distinguish their legions - that is what their eagles were for and were introduced over 100 years BC.

Nothing to do with monarchs as they can be traced back to antiquity in the military, and the church and then the middle ages for all other things.
 
My memory can be foggy - but I think I remember the Duke of Cambridge got a standard from Canada when he and Kate went on their trip there? Does anyone else recall this?
 
AdmirerUS said:
My memory can be foggy - but I think I remember the Duke of Cambridge got a standard from Canada when he and Kate went on their trip there? Does anyone else recall this?
Click to expand...

He does. The Prince of Wales and HM also have Canadian Royal Standards.

The Queen's is the Royal Standard of Canada, defaced with the device of the Queen used on her Head of the Commonwealth flag. Charles and William's standards are similar, but defaced with the Prince of Wales' feathers (Charles) and Williams's cypher (William's). They both also have the label that is used on their personal arms.
 
Royal standards are still in relatively regular use today:
The PoW is said to fly his from Highrove when he is there (or did when Paul Burrel was working there)

In a clip from one of the documentaries about the Royal Family's work I remember seeing Andrew leaving royal Lodge with his standard flying above the house

I know during a recent visit to an RAF base he is Honory Commodore of the standard of the Earl of Wessex was sent to the base by the MOD to fly during the visit. I believe they keep the standards of most royals ready to be sent out before a royal visit.

And here is the Duke of Cambridge's standard flying on one of the more colourful pieces of transport http://theroyalpost.files.wordpress.com/2012/09/article-2203983-150a61a2000005dc-612_964x703.jpg
 
Princess Marina of kent flag

Can anyone help please?
I have found the coat of arms of Princess Marina but not her flag. Any help would be appreciated.
 
Her standard would probably have been her arms in a flag form, if she had her own standard.

If she didn't have one in the UK (most wives of British princes don't) she would have used the Royal Standard of the United Kingdom with an ermine border. This is the standard that was used on the coffins of Diana, Princess of Wales and Princess Alice, Duchess of Gloucester.
 
Thankyou. The Queen Mother had her personalise flag eg the bow lyons o n it.
So I thought that Princess Marina might have had something that showed her Danish/Greek/Russian connections. This whole thing arose from watching her funeral with the coffin draped in a flag. The same happened also with Q Mum flag and I checked up on it thus the bows etc..






Ish said:
Her standard would probably have been her arms in a flag form, if she had her own standard.

If she didn't have one in the UK (most wives of British princes don't) she would have used the Royal Standard of the United Kingdom with an ermine border. This is the standard that was used on the coffins of Diana, Princess of Wales and Princess Alice, Duchess of Gloucester.
Click to expand...
 
joye said:
Thankyou. The Queen Mother had her personalise flag eg the bow lyons o n it.
So I thought that Princess Marina might have had something that showed her Danish/Greek/Russian connections. This whole thing arose from watching her funeral with the coffin draped in a flag. The same happened also with Q Mum flag and I checked up on it thus the bows etc..
Click to expand...


The Queen Mother had her own standard because she was a Queen Consort - Queen Mary and Queen Alexandra also had their own standards. Princess Marina wasn't on the same level.

The flag that draped her coffin would have been the standard that she used.
 
Hi, if the royal standard with an ermine border is used for the wives of British princes. If so why did Diana, Princess of Wales have the royal standard on her coffin, she was the ex-wife of a British prince?
Was this from a protocol perspective correct?
 
Strictly speaking it was a breaking of Royal protocol. It was Charles's decision though. When he went to Paris to collect Diana's body he asked that the Royal Standard be draped over her coffin. Later on the same procedure followed for the funeral cortege and funeral. Diana was after all the mother of princes, one of them an heir to the throne. The honour also matched the mood of the country. I think it was a good decision.
 
Did the royal standard that draped Diana's coffin have an ermine border?
 
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Thank you. That does not appear to be an ermine border.

I agree with Curryong. There was not a lot of precedent on how to deal with a divorced spouse and in the end Diana was afforded royal trappings because she was the mother of a (presumably) future King. Not everyone involved agreed with him, but it was Charles who led the charge and who ultimately prevailed.
 
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I sincerely agreed with Charles. He made sure that Diana was given the full acknowledgment of her remaining in her role as mother to princes of the UK. I don't think I've ever respected Charles as much as I did during that tragic week.
 
Queen Claude said:
Thank you. That does not appear to be an ermine border.

I agree with Curryong. There was not a lot of precedent on how to deal with a divorced spouse and in the end Diana was afforded royal trappings because she was the mother of a (presumably) future King. Not everyone involved agreed with him, but it was Charles who led the charge and who ultimately prevailed.
Click to expand...

That standard has indeed an ermine border, the white border with the recurring black symbol represents the ermine border
 
Isn't the ermine border on the linen Royal Standard symbolic? I can't imagine an army of people sewing a border of fur onto cloth nowadays.

In the #2 post of this thread Ish explains the various Royal Standards and states that Diana did have a Standard with an ermine border at her funeral.

This may seem a strange observation but in the white border of the Standard shown in photos, as below
https://www.thoughtco.com/princess-dianas-funeral-3528738

the small black markings of the sort that are on ermine robes appear to be there on the border.
 
If the royal standard with an ermine border was allowed with Diana as she was the mother of two Princes of the UK, would the same apply to Sarah, Duchess of York as she is the mother of two Princesses of the UK?
 
One must look at everything that happened at Diana's funeral has an exception rather than a rule for ex wives of princes. She had a quasi state funeral, basically because Charles pushed for it, given that she was the mother of a future monarch
 
royal_enthusiast said:
If the royal standard with an ermine border was allowed with Diana as she was the mother of two Princes of the UK, would the same apply to Sarah, Duchess of York as she is the mother of two Princesses of the UK?
Click to expand...

I imagine it's already been decided that she won't have the royal standard because she isn't an HRH. The Duchess of Windsor wasn't an HRH & she didn't have a royal standard. It could be argued that Diana was different because she was the mother of a future king.
 
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