Royal Wealth and Finances 1: Ending 2022


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Smartie2091

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I was wondering if any of the british royals had to sign prenups? like Prince Phillip, Diana, Fergi?
 
Smartie2091 said:
I was wondering if any of the british royals had to sign prenups? like Prince Phillip, Diana, Fergi?
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Well, certainly Diana and Sarah did not. It's not a usual requirement of marriage to a member of the royal family, but perhaps this will change in light of divorce becoming more common these days.

Also, most of the wealth in the royal family belongs to the Sovereign, followed by The Prince of Wales as they receive the income from the duchies of Lancaster and Cornwall. Everyone else is basically dependent on whatever money they may have inherited along the way, which usually is relatively modest.

William and Harry are very wealthy, but most of their inheritance came from The Queen's pocket when Diana received her divorce settlement.
 
branchg,
Thanks for clarifying the prenup situation in Royal marriage. So many people think that being Royal or marrying a Royal means instant wealth. It is more complicated then that. To marry a Prince, Crown Prince, King, etc. doesn't mean one is given access to Royal Family Weath, such as property, artifacts, jewels, other assests, etc.
 
branchg said:
William and Harry are very wealthy, but most of their inheritance came from The Queen's pocket when Diana received her divorce settlement.
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doesn't Diana receive a lot of money from her father&grandma when she got married? (i remember that from some book, whose name i don't remember now)

and why wasn't Prince Charles paying for his divorced wife instead of his mother? i remember reading he was very poor after paying Diana a lot of money(which again i don't remember the source)
 
Avalon said:
Queen Elizabeth didn't pay anything. Prince Charles did. He gave Diana basically everything he had. Check out this one.

http://www.theage.com.au/articles/2004/07/25/1090693836685.html
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As The Prince of Wales Charles only has the income of the duchy of Cornwall - the duchy's possessions are basically tied up in a trust, of which he is the trustee and has a right to all the winnings. Charles spends the winnings by paying for his and his immediate family's upkeep, giving money to charities or organizing events for his charities and by reinvesting the money into the duchy in order to secure the trust for the future heir to the throne.
He does not have his own wealth in terms of having savings or personal investments. He does not need to think this way, so why should he?

Edit: Just read the afore mentioned article and it seems he has managed to keep the trust fund of the duchy not only stable but to make enough money out of it to put a bit of as a personal fortune aside.

And I read, too, that his mother lent him part of the money Diana asked for. The queen, after all, possesses the personal wealth of the souverain and has money she can spent the way she likes beyond the trust funds of the duchy of Lancaster.

I'm not so sure though that Charles minded the money too much as he knew Diana then for quite some time and knew that she was not the one to get into debts easily. While she had been quite expensive in the first years of their marriage she had managed quite well to stick to the money she had inherited from her father's side and had lived within her income (or so I read in the books about the princess). Thus Charles could be pretty sure that most of the money would end up with his own heirs anyway one day - I don't think the chance was very big that Diana would not only marry again but become a mother again. She had reached a certain age and a certain position where returning to the confines of motherhood was probably not really attractive for a mother of two wonderful boys. (That's mere speculation, of course, but then there is a plausibility Charles thought about things like that). And it is usus in the aristocracy from which Diana derived to think foremost of family when it comes to will personal wealth to somebody.

So I guess it was not that big deal for Charles even though it hurts, of course.
 
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Diana inherited money from her great-grandmother when she turned 18, and inherited from her father when he died in 1992. She didn't get anything when she married.

Charles had savings in the form of a stock portfolio. That's what he liquidated to pay off Diana. He does need to provide for Harry, because he's not going to get any money from the monarchy.
 
kelly9480 said:
Diana inherited money from her great-grandmother when she turned 18, and inherited from her father when he died in 1992. She didn't get anything when she married.

Charles had savings in the form of a stock portfolio. That's what he liquidated to pay off Diana. He does need to provide for Harry, because he's not going to get any money from the monarchy.
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Well, he already did that handsomely by paying Diana - Harry surely is better off than prince Andrew ever was.
 
Half of Diana's estate went to the taxman, and what was left was split evenly between William & Harry. EIIR has allegedly established trusts for her grandchildren, so Harry would also have that, but a lot depends on how much money Harry spends and he's developed a taste for expensive vacations. His father won't be footing the bill for those forever, so Harry will have to dip into his own money.
 
diana got £17,000,000 when she got divorced, it is believed that her divorce settlement is the biggest in british law history( the average is about £10 million), harry is set to inherit half of his mothers' estate(including jewellery and personal property),£25,000,000 ( making him the 4th richest teenager in Britain according to forbes), he has also inherited a sum from his maternal grandmother and grandfather, the Queen mother( believed to be £5 million) and the Queen. He is also set to inherit a sum from all his godparents.
harry is set to inherit all this due to diana's and royal family's determination for him to be able to cope in being a spare to william financially.
 
it is believed that one of the major factors in the breakdown of the york's marriage( apart from infidelity on the duchess' part) was their financial troubles( the duchess being in debt), bearing in mind the lifestyle they have to lead, which include parties, donations, clothes, jewellery, staff, household and children. prince andrew's allowance wasn't good enough( he didn't inherit much for anyone or had a trust in his name), so i guess the royals have learnt their lesson and are better prepared this time around.
 
This is an interesting topic, and although it started off as "Prenups" (which was answered pretty quickly) it has continued into broader areas.

New thread title: 'The Royals and Finances'.

Warren
Britsh Forums moderator
 
pinkylou said:
it is believed that one of the major factors in the breakdown of the york's marriage( apart from infidelity on the duchess' part) was their financial troubles( the duchess being in debt), bearing in mind the lifestyle they have to lead, which include parties, donations, clothes, jewellery, staff, household and children. prince andrew's allowance wasn't good enough( he didn't inherit much for anyone or had a trust in his name), so i guess the royals have learnt their lesson and are better prepared this time around.
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I always thought and still think that one reason why Sarah and Andrew decided to get a dicorce was that this would free Sarah to use her fame in order to make money. What other way was there besides asking the queen (again) for it. Maybe the queen even payed some of the debts or lent the money to better conditions than a bank would?

I have no proof besides the fact that it was written in several sources that Sarah managed to get rid of her debts (even in her own book), but still is a friend of her former husband.

Plus she was able to cash in on her former Royality in order to get money to spent on her daughters. All that would have been impossible if she still was married to Prince Andrew.

It surely wasn't the only reason but still I think it was one that was considered as positive. Especially as neither Sarah nor Andrew flaunt lovers in public but are seen together quite often.
 
This subject fascinates me! Is it possible that there are members of a royal family who don't have anything besides what they receive from the civil lists?
Not only minor members of the RF(the Kents)? maybe also from the other royal families of europe?
 
Every member of the British RF has or had trust funds. Some of them have depleted their trusts, like Marina Mowatt and the Kents, but none of them were not provided for by their parents. Prince Michael sold off some of his stock portfolio to fund his lifestyle, and the loss of income has seriously hurst his familiy over the years.
 
pinkylou said:
diana got £17,000,000 when she got divorced, it is believed that her divorce settlement is the biggest in british law history( the average is about £10 million), harry is set to inherit half of his mothers' estate(including jewellery and personal property),£25,000,000 ( making him the 4th richest teenager in Britain according to forbes), he has also inherited a sum from his maternal grandmother and grandfather, the Queen mother( believed to be £5 million) and the Queen. He is also set to inherit a sum from all his godparents.
harry is set to inherit all this due to diana's and royal family's determination for him to be able to cope in being a spare to william financially.
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Harry probably didn't inherit anything from Earl Spencer. Earl Spencer left each of his daughters stocks worth (in 1992 terms) around £5 million. How much that's worth now depends on how well that portfolio has been managed, but no sources have stated Spencer left his grandchildren money.

Considering the QM's debts, some sources doubt she ever established trusts for her grandchildren, which contradicts the long-held belief that she did, but of course, no one knows for sure outside the Windsors and their financial advisers.

Diana's wealth (in cash & stocks) was around £22m at her death. Her jewellery was estimated to be worth about £2m by Andrew Morton in that Windsor Wealth book, but Morton's estimates purposefully didn't take into account royal provenance, so the jewels would actually be worth much more. There's some doubt whether Harry could inherit evenly in the jewellery. Obviously, pieces that came from the Windsors' historical collection, like the tiara and the emerald necklace, will go to William so as to stay in the family. Is the rest of the stuff worth enough to make up for William getting the historical pieces? I think a lot would depend on which son got the sapphire brooch.
 
Diana's share of the Spencer estate was put into a trust for Harry at her request by the Earl Spencer. This was done to ensure Harry would have some money of his own since William will receive the income from the duchy of Cornwall and inherit the Sovereign's fortune.

The Queen Mother did transfer most of her liquid wealth, estimated at $10 million, into irrevocable trusts for her great-grandchildren. They receive the income until Charles becomes King, at which time the trusts terminate and the principal is distributed to Anne, Edward and Andrew equally.

The Queen set-up trusts for her grandchildren, but not William or Harry since they have substantial assets of their own.
 
Did the Queen's Mum set up trusts for the Armstrong Jones (Princess Margeret's) children?
and who set up trust funds for the Kents? Their father was killed very early on? Was it Queen Mary or who else?
 
George V left money in trust funds for his younger sons, which would include the Duke of Kent. The Duke did die young, but he outlived his father.
 
kelly9480 said:
Harry probably didn't inherit anything from Earl Spencer. Earl Spencer left each of his daughters stocks worth (in 1992 terms) around £5 million. How much that's worth now depends on how well that portfolio has been managed, but no sources have stated Spencer left his grandchildren money.

Considering the QM's debts, some sources doubt she ever established trusts for her grandchildren, which contradicts the long-held belief that she did, but of course, no one knows for sure outside the Windsors and their financial advisers.

Diana's wealth (in cash & stocks) was around £22m at her death. Her jewellery was estimated to be worth about £2m by Andrew Morton in that Windsor Wealth book, but Morton's estimates purposefully didn't take into account royal provenance, so the jewels would actually be worth much more. There's some doubt whether Harry could inherit evenly in the jewellery. Obviously, pieces that came from the Windsors' historical collection, like the tiara and the emerald necklace, will go to William so as to stay in the family. Is the rest of the stuff worth enough to make up for William getting the historical pieces? I think a lot would depend on which son got the sapphire brooch.
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a very well respected royal correspondent in the UK James Whittaker, has said in many british tv programmes that half of diana's estate will evenly be divided between her sons as stated in her will, william won't be taking all her jewellery due to the fact that one day he will be king, and also she felt that no distinction should arise between her two sons. in another documentary, one of the queen's cousin did verify that the queen has a trust for all her grandchildren including anne's children.
and yes earl spencer has opened a trust for harry, diana's brother also spoke of it in a programme i once watched over here in the UK ( i believe it was tonight with trevor macdonald)
 
Here's what I can't quite grasp-- what about Princess Margaret? In light of her jewels and items from her personal collection to be auctioned off at Christie's-- does that mean that she didn't leave much to her children, Lady Sarah and Viscount Linley? Why would they need to sell her jewellery, i.e. the Queen Mary riviere and the Poltimore tiara, (esp the diamond riviere, which has such significant royal provenance)? it was said in an article that proceeds will go to paying inheritance taxes... Did she leave much to her children??
 
auntie said:
Did the Queen's Mum set up trusts for the Armstrong Jones (Princess Margeret's) children?
and who set up trust funds for the Kents? Their father was killed very early on? Was it Queen Mary or who else?
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The Queen takes care of Viscount Linley and Lady Sarah. In addition, Princess Margaret had a small fortune of her own, including her home in Mustique, which Viscount Linley most likely inherited.

George V set-up trusts for The Dukes of Kent, Gloucester and York (Edward was Prince of Wales and had his own money from the duchy of Cornwall). In addition, Princess Alice inherited money from her father, The Duke of Buccleuch, which Prince Richard probably benefits from.
 
ingenue said:
Here's what I can't quite grasp-- what about Princess Margaret? In light of her jewels and items from her personal collection to be auctioned off at Christie's-- does that mean that she didn't leave much to her children, Lady Sarah and Viscount Linley? Why would they need to sell her jewellery, i.e. the Queen Mary riviere and the Poltimore tiara, (esp the diamond riviere, which has such significant royal provenance)? it was said in an article that proceeds will go to paying inheritance taxes... Did she leave much to her children??
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Viscount Linley owes inheritance tax on Margaret's estate and will use the proceeds from the auction to meet the bill. It is generally believed Margaret had a small fortune in the range of $2-3 million, invested in stocks and bonds.

Most of the jewelry being auctioned would likely have sat in a vault somewhere. It's unlikely Lady Serena or Lady Sarah need to wear valuable jewels or a large tiara appropriate for a Royal Highness.
 
branchg said:
The Queen takes care of Viscount Linley and Lady Sarah. In addition, Princess Margaret had a small fortune of her own, including her home in Mustique, which Viscount Linley most likely inherited.
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The Queen doesn't help them financially the way she helps her children. If she did, David wouldn't be constantly complaining of how broke he is, time and again, in his interviews. He has always said that he pays his own way, though EIIR's use of his company helped raise his profile.
 
branchg said:
Viscount Linley owes inheritance tax on Margaret's estate and will use the proceeds from the auction to meet the bill. It is generally believed Margaret had a small fortune in the range of $2-3 million, invested in stocks and bonds.

Most of the jewelry being auctioned would likely have sat in a vault somewhere. It's unlikely Lady Serena or Lady Sarah need to wear valuable jewels or a large tiara appropriate for a Royal Highness.
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According to BP, Margaret left around 7 million pounds, not including the things she had transferred over before her death to avoid death duties. Both children owe on the estate taxes, not just David, because they both inherited from her. Margaret's fortune was estimated by one biographer (who admitted he couldn't stand her, so take it was a heap of salt) at around 30 million pounds, if all her belongings were included, meaning the house, the jewels, the cars, etc.
 
kelly9480 said:
According to BP, Margaret left around 7 million pounds, not including the things she had transferred over before her death to avoid death duties. Both children owe on the estate taxes, not just David, because they both inherited from her. Margaret's fortune was estimated by one biographer (who admitted he couldn't stand her, so take it was a heap of salt) at around 30 million pounds, if all her belongings were included, meaning the house, the jewels, the cars, etc.
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It is a bit confusing reading the different estimates as to Princess Margaret's worth at death. $2-3 million dollars in not very much. A good investor, who worked at a decent job in the states would leave more than that. It seems to me it is probabaly between the 7million and the overstated 30 million pounds. It is sad that they have to sell off what should be a historical inheritance. The Queen Mother was able to tranfer, tax free, all of her valuables, in the Soverign to Soverign transfer and now the Queen is free to pass out the goodies to her children, without there being any tax. While Pricess Margaret's children are not so fortunate. Those with the most pay the least.
 
branchg said:
Well, certainly Diana and Sarah did not. It's not a usual requirement of marriage to a member of the royal family, but perhaps this will change in light of divorce becoming more common these days.

Also, most of the wealth in the royal family belongs to the Sovereign, followed by The Prince of Wales as they receive the income from the duchies of Lancaster and Cornwall. Everyone else is basically dependent on whatever money they may have inherited along the way, which usually is relatively modest.

William and Harry are very wealthy, but most of their inheritance came from The Queen's pocket when Diana received her divorce settlement.
Click to expand...

so technically they're not really wealthy yet but will be when they come into their inheritance??
 
Duchess said:
so technically they're not really wealthy yet but will be when they come into their inheritance??
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William and Harry are certainly very wealthy by most standards for young men their age. At this point, they are receiving a sizable income from their mother's trust, their great-grandmother's trust, plus whatever Harry may be receiving from his Spencer trust.

I don't think we have to worry too much.
 
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