British Royal Jewels of the Past 1: Ending 2021
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When the current Duchess of Gloucester, Duchess of Kent and Princess Michael of Kent die, what will happen to their very historic tiaras? Personally, I think they should be given to whoever is monarch at the time so that they have a chance to be worn because the children of these women probably won't have the chance to wear tiaras as often as the people who will be the main members of the royal family at that point. If you don't know what will happen to those jewels, what do you think will or should happen to them?
Fireweaver
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Apparently the Queen Mum had some debts that needed paying off. She had a lot of valuable items, but not a lot of actual cash.
Here's the description of the parure, from the Royal Jewels of the World Website
By Tradition from the Collection of a European Royal Family
An Attractive Amethyst And Diamond Parure
19th Century
comprising: a Tiara, circa 1815, of Empire style,
the tapered band with cushioned-shaped amethysts
bordered by similarly shaped diamonds, later
fittings and several repairs; a Necklace, circa 1815,
designed as a row of ten oval amethysts graduated
in size from the front and each bordered by cushion-
shaped diamonds and connected by diamond quatrefoil
motifs, the front supporting detachable pear-shaped
amethyst drops, four of which are briolette, all the
clusters are detachable; a pair of Earrings of
similar design, early 19th Century; and a Ring,
last quarter of the 19th Century, slightly imperfect.
$75,000 - $125,000 USD / 115,000 - 190,000 SF
http://royal-jewels3.tripod.com/auction/amethyst.html
Here's the description of the parure, from the Royal Jewels of the World Website
By Tradition from the Collection of a European Royal Family
An Attractive Amethyst And Diamond Parure
19th Century
comprising: a Tiara, circa 1815, of Empire style,
the tapered band with cushioned-shaped amethysts
bordered by similarly shaped diamonds, later
fittings and several repairs; a Necklace, circa 1815,
designed as a row of ten oval amethysts graduated
in size from the front and each bordered by cushion-
shaped diamonds and connected by diamond quatrefoil
motifs, the front supporting detachable pear-shaped
amethyst drops, four of which are briolette, all the
clusters are detachable; a pair of Earrings of
similar design, early 19th Century; and a Ring,
last quarter of the 19th Century, slightly imperfect.
$75,000 - $125,000 USD / 115,000 - 190,000 SF
http://royal-jewels3.tripod.com/auction/amethyst.html
gogm
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There was a picture of Queen Alexandra in a heavily ornamented dress. Renaissance revival balls were very popular then. It was a chance for the aristocracy to dress even more lavishly than they normally did (!). I wouldn't be surprised if she wore it at the Devonshire House costume ball in 1897. The Victoria and Albert has photos from Lafayette Studios of many socialites of the era at this party (as well as photos for her husband's coronation, debuts, openings of Parliament, etc. that are often breathtaking), including her husband, but none linking her to this party. It's at:
http://www.lafayette.150m.com/dhblist.html
http://www.lafayette.150m.com/dhblist.html
wymanda
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tiaraprin
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I have a couple of questions about Diana's jewelry that I have not been able to answer--maybe someone on here knows the answers I seek.
Where did Diana get the ameythyst 2 row choker with the diamond/amethyst center and the matching earrings?
Where did the beautiful long drop aquamarine and diamond earrings she wore come from. She famously wore these earrings in Cannes in 1987 with her "Grace Kelly" look.
Just before Diana died, she wore a stupendous diamond and pearl necklace with an ice blue dress. I cannot find where that came from too.
Where did Diana get the ameythyst 2 row choker with the diamond/amethyst center and the matching earrings?
Where did the beautiful long drop aquamarine and diamond earrings she wore come from. She famously wore these earrings in Cannes in 1987 with her "Grace Kelly" look.
Just before Diana died, she wore a stupendous diamond and pearl necklace with an ice blue dress. I cannot find where that came from too.
The Kent and Gloucester jewels will either remain with the Kents and Gloucesters or will be sold. When the Kents sold a historic tiara, EIIR didn't bother buying it. There is no history of giving the jewels back to the main line when there are descendants who could inherit them.
The Harewood jewels remained with the Harewoods or were auctioned at several sales. None went back to the Windsors.
The Harewood jewels remained with the Harewoods or were auctioned at several sales. None went back to the Windsors.
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tiaraprin
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really Kelly?? I would have imagined that Her Majesty would have wanted them back considering the connection to Queen Mary and to pass them to a new generation of royal princesses.
She was reported to have said they had too much jewellery already.
The tiara shape was rather old-fashioned and probably wouldn't have been worn often anyways because the rest of the parure stayed with the Kents.
The tiara shape was rather old-fashioned and probably wouldn't have been worn often anyways because the rest of the parure stayed with the Kents.
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When the jewels are given to a member of the royal family, it's given. If the Queen liked them, she would need to approach this person and try to negotiate a price^^ Dont think there is anyone who would "donate" their jewels (properties) other than the most common reason which is "for charity"^^
I think we should stand at the owners' point of view. These days, junior members aren't very rich and they view their jewels they inherited from their ancestors a very important part of their wealth.
I think we should stand at the owners' point of view. These days, junior members aren't very rich and they view their jewels they inherited from their ancestors a very important part of their wealth.
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It doesn't matter whether we think the jewels should go back to the main line; they don't agree with us. And since the Windsors refuse to create a family foundation, like in some countries, jewels are going to keep leaving the family.
They see their jewels as part of their wealth and heritage, and also a way to meet death duties, because they don't have a lot of cash at hand, and don't have really spectacular artwork they can donate in lieu of cash. They have their homes, their jewels, some minor artworks that probably aren't going to cover the death duties, and stock options.
They see their jewels as part of their wealth and heritage, and also a way to meet death duties, because they don't have a lot of cash at hand, and don't have really spectacular artwork they can donate in lieu of cash. They have their homes, their jewels, some minor artworks that probably aren't going to cover the death duties, and stock options.
There are going to be major death duties to pay when the Duke of Gloucester dies since he still owns Barnwell as well as all that jewellery. Since his daughters and daughter in law aren't living the sorts of lives where major jewellery is essential, it's likely that tiaras and other pieces of jewellery will be used to pay the estate tax, as happened with Princess Mary, rather than selling Barnwell. I assume the same situation, although to probably a lesser extent, applies to the Kents.
What are death duties??? Sounds like "death" is even taxed in UK. Maybe it's there to help to create more balance between the rich and the ordinaries, but I really dont like the sight of seeing people die and their family gets alot less wealthy.
The jewels of the minor royals are not part of the British Crown Jewels. I really think if the senior royalties wants to own them, they should pay the price. UK is a capitalist country.
The jewels of the minor royals are not part of the British Crown Jewels. I really think if the senior royalties wants to own them, they should pay the price. UK is a capitalist country.
Death duties are taxes paid on a deceased person's estate. People can place their belongings in trusts, and pass ownership to someone else before their deaths to try to get around them
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Most wealthy people put their belongings in trusts to avoid death duties. They also pass things on before they die. They end up paying death duties, but it doesn't put a significant dent in their family wealth because of the loopholes they make use of.
wymanda
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Some time ago we discussed the Turkish necklace which Queen Victoria wore at her wedding and the christening of her eldest child. The piece passed out of the royal family when QV left it to her son the Duke of Connaught. Is it possible that this piece, pictured in the link below, passed to either Lady Patricia Ramsay (born Princess Patricia of Connaught) or to the Swedish royals through Princess Margaret of Connaught who was mother to Denmark's Queen Ingrid. If so and if Ingrid inherited it we may see Mary wear this emotive jewel.
http://www.jewelrybyrhonda.com/queen_victoria5.jpg
http://www.jewelrybyrhonda.com/queen_victoria5.jpg
If the Swedes/Danes had inherited it, we would have seen it by now, simply because between all of Crown Princess Margaret's collection was worn, dismantled or sold. Ingrid inherited the majority of her mother's jewels and she was never seen with this necklace. It may have gone to Patricia, but from her, who knows where it may be.
wymanda
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It is assumed that she must have had it as Queen Victoria left it to the Duke of Connaught. It didn't go to Princess Margaret of Sweden (as we haven't seen either the Danish or Swedish ladies wearing it) and the Duke was predeceased by his son. Lady Patricia was the only surviving child. Unless it was sold it would have gone to Lady Patricia.
Does anyone know what descendants she has still living???
Does anyone know what descendants she has still living???
tiaraprin
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Captain Alexander Ramsey of Mar was born on December 21, 1919 and is the only child of Lady Patricia Ramsey, nee Princess Patricia of Connaught.
He married the Hon. Flora Fraser in 1956 and they have three daughters: Katherine, Alice, and Elizabeth.
He married the Hon. Flora Fraser in 1956 and they have three daughters: Katherine, Alice, and Elizabeth.
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wymanda
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Captain Alexander Ramsay of Mar
(Filed: 21/12/2000)
Great-grandson of Queen Victoria more at home as a Highland laird than as a member of the wider Royal Family
CAPTAIN ALEXANDER RAMSAY OF MAR, who has died on the eve of his 81st birthday, was among the last surviving great-grandchildren of Queen Victoria and was perhaps the least familiar member of the extended Royal Family. The laird of Mar was the only son of Lady Patricia Ramsay, younger daughter of Prince Arthur, Duke of Connaught, who was Queen Victoria's third (and favourite) son.
Born Princess Patricia of Connaught, she had renounced her royal style and title upon her marriage in 1919 to Admiral Sir Alexander Ramsay, a son of the 13th Earl of Dalhousie, whom she had met when he was ADC to her father, then Governor-General of Canada. Their wedding, held at Westminster Abbey, was the first great royal occasion after the end of the war, and the focus of much public celebration.
Their son's birth was widely welcomed, so much so that the Admiral was heard to say: "They talk of Patsy's baby all the time. Where do I come in?" His son was senior to at least one member of the Royal Family, Princess Alice, Countess of Athlone, in the Lord Chamberlain's list. As such, he was unlucky to have no royal title himself.
Had King George V not restricted the use of the title of Prince from 1917, Ramsay might have been born Prince Alexander, adopting a similar style to his first cousin, Prince Alastair (later the last Duke of Connaught). As it was, Ramsay was immensely proud of his royal connections, and was invariably present on the larger royal occasions. In later life, he would complain light-heartedly that these excursions into the bright lights too often obliged him to shed his tweed and to don a dinner jacket.
Alexander Arthur Alfonso David Maule Ramsay was born in his mother's bathroom at Clarence House, then home to the Duke of Connaught, on December 21 1919. He was christened in the Chapel Royal, St James's, in the presence of George V and Queens Mary and Alexandra. Two of Queen Victoria's daughters were also at the ceremony, Princess Louise, Duchess of Argyll, and Princess Christian, who was a godmother and held the infant Sandy during the service. According to one report: "the dear little fellow behaved in the most exemplary manner and was warmly approved of by all present". Other sponsors included the Prince of Wales, later Edward VIII, and King Alfonso of Spain.
Ramsay was also closely related to the Swedish, Danish and Norwegian royal families. His aunt, Princess Margaret of Connaught, was the first wife of King Gustav VI Adolph of Sweden, and he was thus a cousin of her daughter, the late Queen Ingrid of Denmark.
Sandy Ramsay was a playmate of the present Queen when young and in 1937 was a Page of Honour at the Coronation of King George VI. He went to Eton, and in 1938 was commissioned into the Grenadier Guards; his grandfather, the Duke, was Colonel of the regiment. He fought with them in North Africa during the Second World War, and in 1943 lost his right leg below the knee as a result of a wound sustained during a tank battle near Medjez, Tunisia. Thereafter he made use of an artificial limb; his disability never prevented him from wearing the kilt.
From 1944 he was for three years ADC to his cousin, the Duke of Gloucester, who was Governor-General of Australia. Halfway through his time there, Ramsay was lucky to escape with his life when his car became trapped between two trams in Sydney and was sliced in half. Ramsay knew that it was intended that he should inherit the Mar estates near Balmoral from his aunt, Princess Arthur of Connaught, and on leaving the Army in 1947 he went up to Trinity College, Oxford, to read Agriculture.
The story is told that early in his first term Ramsay approached the Dean of the college to ask permission to miss a tutorial to attend the wedding of his mother's third cousin. This request did not impress the Dean, until the modest Ramsay revealed that the bride was Princess Elizabeth. Ramsay subsequently spent three years as an assistant factor on the Linlithgow estates at South Queensferry, and then in 1959 came into the 100,000 acres of the Mar estates, which afforded good stalking and timber.
Although forced to sell the greater portion to alleviate death duties, he was permitted to add the Mar style to his name. In 1991 he was sad to hear the news of the destruction of Mar Lodge by fire, though it had long since passed from his hands.
"The house," he remembered, "was marvellously vast. I once came down to dinner and found I'd forgotten my handkerchief. There was a clock on the wall, and when I got back from my room I noticed that it had taken me a quarter of an hour - and I hadn't been dawdling." He was cheered to learn that the wooden ballroom, with 3,000 antlers on the walls, had survived. In the 1980s he built himself a new house, designed by Oliver Humphries, on the estate.
In 1956, having obtained the necessary formal assent from the Queen, Ramsay married Flora Fraser, whom he had met at the Perth Hunt Ball. She later succeeded to her father's titles as Lady Saltoun and Chief of the Name of Fraser, and they lived at her ancestral seat, Cairnbulg Castle, Fraserburgh, Aberdeenshire. There Ramsay was much occupied with estate and charitable duties; in 1971 he became a Deputy Lieutenant for the county.
For more than 30 years he was chairman of the executive committee of the Scottish Life Boat Council, and since 1959 had been vice-patron of the Braemar Royal Highland Society, which supervises the annual Games attended by the Royal Family.
Captain Ramsay was a devotee of family and Scottish history, and took a keen interest in heraldry. He also enjoyed shooting, sailing and travelling. He is survived by his wife and by their three daughters.
(Filed: 21/12/2000)
Great-grandson of Queen Victoria more at home as a Highland laird than as a member of the wider Royal Family
CAPTAIN ALEXANDER RAMSAY OF MAR, who has died on the eve of his 81st birthday, was among the last surviving great-grandchildren of Queen Victoria and was perhaps the least familiar member of the extended Royal Family. The laird of Mar was the only son of Lady Patricia Ramsay, younger daughter of Prince Arthur, Duke of Connaught, who was Queen Victoria's third (and favourite) son.
Born Princess Patricia of Connaught, she had renounced her royal style and title upon her marriage in 1919 to Admiral Sir Alexander Ramsay, a son of the 13th Earl of Dalhousie, whom she had met when he was ADC to her father, then Governor-General of Canada. Their wedding, held at Westminster Abbey, was the first great royal occasion after the end of the war, and the focus of much public celebration.
Their son's birth was widely welcomed, so much so that the Admiral was heard to say: "They talk of Patsy's baby all the time. Where do I come in?" His son was senior to at least one member of the Royal Family, Princess Alice, Countess of Athlone, in the Lord Chamberlain's list. As such, he was unlucky to have no royal title himself.
Had King George V not restricted the use of the title of Prince from 1917, Ramsay might have been born Prince Alexander, adopting a similar style to his first cousin, Prince Alastair (later the last Duke of Connaught). As it was, Ramsay was immensely proud of his royal connections, and was invariably present on the larger royal occasions. In later life, he would complain light-heartedly that these excursions into the bright lights too often obliged him to shed his tweed and to don a dinner jacket.
Alexander Arthur Alfonso David Maule Ramsay was born in his mother's bathroom at Clarence House, then home to the Duke of Connaught, on December 21 1919. He was christened in the Chapel Royal, St James's, in the presence of George V and Queens Mary and Alexandra. Two of Queen Victoria's daughters were also at the ceremony, Princess Louise, Duchess of Argyll, and Princess Christian, who was a godmother and held the infant Sandy during the service. According to one report: "the dear little fellow behaved in the most exemplary manner and was warmly approved of by all present". Other sponsors included the Prince of Wales, later Edward VIII, and King Alfonso of Spain.
Ramsay was also closely related to the Swedish, Danish and Norwegian royal families. His aunt, Princess Margaret of Connaught, was the first wife of King Gustav VI Adolph of Sweden, and he was thus a cousin of her daughter, the late Queen Ingrid of Denmark.
Sandy Ramsay was a playmate of the present Queen when young and in 1937 was a Page of Honour at the Coronation of King George VI. He went to Eton, and in 1938 was commissioned into the Grenadier Guards; his grandfather, the Duke, was Colonel of the regiment. He fought with them in North Africa during the Second World War, and in 1943 lost his right leg below the knee as a result of a wound sustained during a tank battle near Medjez, Tunisia. Thereafter he made use of an artificial limb; his disability never prevented him from wearing the kilt.
From 1944 he was for three years ADC to his cousin, the Duke of Gloucester, who was Governor-General of Australia. Halfway through his time there, Ramsay was lucky to escape with his life when his car became trapped between two trams in Sydney and was sliced in half. Ramsay knew that it was intended that he should inherit the Mar estates near Balmoral from his aunt, Princess Arthur of Connaught, and on leaving the Army in 1947 he went up to Trinity College, Oxford, to read Agriculture.
The story is told that early in his first term Ramsay approached the Dean of the college to ask permission to miss a tutorial to attend the wedding of his mother's third cousin. This request did not impress the Dean, until the modest Ramsay revealed that the bride was Princess Elizabeth. Ramsay subsequently spent three years as an assistant factor on the Linlithgow estates at South Queensferry, and then in 1959 came into the 100,000 acres of the Mar estates, which afforded good stalking and timber.
Although forced to sell the greater portion to alleviate death duties, he was permitted to add the Mar style to his name. In 1991 he was sad to hear the news of the destruction of Mar Lodge by fire, though it had long since passed from his hands.
"The house," he remembered, "was marvellously vast. I once came down to dinner and found I'd forgotten my handkerchief. There was a clock on the wall, and when I got back from my room I noticed that it had taken me a quarter of an hour - and I hadn't been dawdling." He was cheered to learn that the wooden ballroom, with 3,000 antlers on the walls, had survived. In the 1980s he built himself a new house, designed by Oliver Humphries, on the estate.
In 1956, having obtained the necessary formal assent from the Queen, Ramsay married Flora Fraser, whom he had met at the Perth Hunt Ball. She later succeeded to her father's titles as Lady Saltoun and Chief of the Name of Fraser, and they lived at her ancestral seat, Cairnbulg Castle, Fraserburgh, Aberdeenshire. There Ramsay was much occupied with estate and charitable duties; in 1971 he became a Deputy Lieutenant for the county.
For more than 30 years he was chairman of the executive committee of the Scottish Life Boat Council, and since 1959 had been vice-patron of the Braemar Royal Highland Society, which supervises the annual Games attended by the Royal Family.
Captain Ramsay was a devotee of family and Scottish history, and took a keen interest in heraldry. He also enjoyed shooting, sailing and travelling. He is survived by his wife and by their three daughters.
wymanda
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Born a Princess of Denmark Queen Alexandra collected, and wore, some amazing jewels.
http://cache.gettyimages.com/comp/3282643.jpg?x=x&dasite=MS_GINS&ef=2&ev=1&dareq=9D2FCAED19187A8474BA52FBF3F765F1
http://cache.gettyimages.com/comp/3164944.jpg?x=x&dasite=MS_GINS&ef=2&ev=1&dareq=FE5EC86FF044365BB83C76F88411A8BC
Coronation
http://cache.gettyimages.com/comp/3087778.jpg?x=x&dasite=MS_GINS&ef=2&ev=1&dareq=2A12C99B8E7B5AC2CF939D753FF7A867
1st Opening of Parliament after the death of Queen Victoria
http://cache.gettyimages.com/comp/2634135.jpg?x=x&dasite=MS_GINS&ef=2&ev=1&dareq=C8CDB000B868A69B00D52C4FD577FA13
http://cache.gettyimages.com/comp/3282643.jpg?x=x&dasite=MS_GINS&ef=2&ev=1&dareq=9D2FCAED19187A8474BA52FBF3F765F1
http://cache.gettyimages.com/comp/3164944.jpg?x=x&dasite=MS_GINS&ef=2&ev=1&dareq=FE5EC86FF044365BB83C76F88411A8BC
Coronation
http://cache.gettyimages.com/comp/3087778.jpg?x=x&dasite=MS_GINS&ef=2&ev=1&dareq=2A12C99B8E7B5AC2CF939D753FF7A867
1st Opening of Parliament after the death of Queen Victoria
http://cache.gettyimages.com/comp/2634135.jpg?x=x&dasite=MS_GINS&ef=2&ev=1&dareq=C8CDB000B868A69B00D52C4FD577FA13
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reynard
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Very true. Unfortunately we haven't seen many of these jewels in a long time. I know the Queen Mum wore Alexandra's pearl and diamond necklace (the stripped down version), but so many more haven' t been seen in a long time such as the Rundell tiara.
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reynard
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reynard
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Alexandra at the state opening of parliament
Wearing a regal circlet, her collier resiller and QV's small crown.
HMQueenElizabethII
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ritapaiva
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sorry
Let see if now it works
Let see if now it works
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